Hello,
I'm currently looking to join any type of martial arts class for self defense in the summer. However, I would like to know the different options that I may choose and which one may be best suited for me since there are many types.
What I am seeking at the moment is any type of unarmed self defense that strengthens my reaction time and also fighting techniques. The problem right now is that a lot of the different classes that teach styles such as Kung Fu or karate does not seem viable, either for the reason that it is more of a "art" rather than realistic fighting tactics and also for the fact that since most martial art styles do not need government licenses, most likely many classes are not fully legit and I'm afraid the instructors might not be qualified.
So I was wondering if anyone have suggestions as to what type of martial art I should choose for a more realistic learning experience in self defense.
Self defense class options?
Please ignore travis's answer. While these are both good styles, and would probably serve you well, they are not the ultimate. No style is or there would not be so many.
Contrary to what you think, and what a lot fo people do not want to accept on here is Traditional karate, kung fu, TKD are very effective styles for self defense, if you have a good instructor and the class trains them for realism and not sport. They have been around a long time, and the MARINES who brought karate back from Okinawa felt it was very good for self defense. Karate and the others when trained for sport are not great for self defense, just as any other style would not be.
As for your question if all you are looking for is self defense I would not suggest a traditional Martial Art, as these on purpose take a pretty long time to learn anything but the most rudimentary self defense. This is specificly taught this way so that your instructor can gauge your charicter before teaching you moves that could be deadly if trained well and used right. My guess is you would probably want to check out Krav Maga or another reality based fighting system if you only want to learn quick self defense.
Beware that the same thing that happened to karate etc., people maybe earning a blue to black belt and opening their own schools when they really don't know what they are doing, to make money, is probably going to catch up to the reality styles and MMA gym's, so make sure you check the instructor and the school out very well.
Hope this helps.
Reply:Krav Maga was developed in Israel right around it's forming in the midst of a bunch of countries that want to invade them. The civilian version focuses on making sure that you come out of even the worst of situations alive, including disarming knives/guns, fighting multiple opponents, and fighting when exhausted, blinded, or otherwise disabled. It's very often called the art of dirty fighting, and nothing could be more true. I've seen a Krav Maga instructor yell at a student for reasons including not kicking someone in the gonads when the opportunity presented itself, not picking up a stick to use mid-fight, and various other things. Krav Maga stresses that on the street, there are no rules, and that you should fight accordingly.
Reply:the 2 best martial arts for self defense are muay thai and japanese kickboxing!
Reply:Most good schools and instructors allow you to watch a class or two before signing up or joining. I suspect that the problem is that you are looking for a summer only type class or short class and a lot of instructors don't want a student only for the summer. The problem with such classes is that they take up the instructor's time and energy and usually compete with prime time classes where he has more students. Also most people while they say they want self-defense really don't make a serious commitment and dedicate their time, effort, and energy over a three month period and are willing to attend a class regularly so instructors either offer just mini seminars or nothing in itself at all like what you are looking for. Keep shopping and you will find something like that probably before anything else.
wallflower
Saturday, November 14, 2009
What are some good, simple self-defense moves?
I'm a wuss %26amp; a coward. I admit it. I've always been a very weak guy who doesn't know anything about fighting. As a result, I have been bullied a lot in my life, especially in my teen years %26amp; have had never had a girlfriend. I am in my mid-20's now %26amp; don't have any problems with bullies, but I still have never had a GF and I sometimes have a habit of letting jerks walk all over me. It rarely happens %26amp; I have gotten better at standing up for myself, but I am always secretly scared whenever I do stand up for myself %26amp; I think I'd have more self-confidence if I knew how to defend myself. I've tried both Kung-Fu %26amp; boxing, but it never worked out. I'm a simple guy who wants to know just a small hand full of some simple self-defense moves. I don't wanna ever actually engage in a fight. My plan is, if I ever have to fight is to do the simple self defense move, then run away %26amp; call the police. I'm not a fighter. I don't wanna be a fighter. I just wanna learn how to survive %26amp; be more confident.
What are some good, simple self-defense moves?
You are your own worse enemy in that you are what and how you think you are. You make statements like, ' I am a wuss and a coward." Your subconscious mind says OK, your wish is my command, and you are therefore a wuss and a coward.
With the proper mindset and self confidence which will come from inside after you have re-written your " Rules of Engagement", if you will, you will become a new man, and without the ongoing fear factor, you will find less desire or need for learning an effective fight system. Without the proper mindset and self confidence, Steven Segal would be a wuss and a coward. It is imperative you master these two qualities first, before learning any fight system.
After having done that, get ready for that special woman in your life, as she will soon be there for you.
You can take all the flying lessons in the world, but if you have a fear of flying, all the training will be useless if you cannot apply it.
Start immediately in re-programming your subconscious mind with positive affirmations, Pen and paper, and write statements such as, " I am very self confident". or " Women are attracted to me because of my high level of self confidence". Write each of these affirmations 10 times or more, and do this daily.
Use subliminal programs to re-program your sub conscious mind for a high level of self confidence. When the changes take place on the subconscious level, the changes will come from the inside out without interference from your conscious mind.
After you have gained a respect for yourself, then check out the IDF ( Israeli defense force) fight system, Krav Maga. This is what law enforcement agents learn. You would benefit greatly from enrolling in a training course, or there are highly effective training films available on the Internet.
In summary, start by building your self confidence and mindset and you will find your need for a fight system will have diminished considerably. But if you feel the need, get some Krav Maga training and you will be mentally equiped to fight to the finish and come out the winner whether against CQB ( Close Quarter Battle) hand to hand or weapons attack.
Note: Recently, Body Weapons had a special on Krav Maga and the two trainees who were already trained in many martial arts systems, were totally unequiped to deal with the Krav Maga fighters tactics. This included vicious knife attacks from knife fighting professionals, which Krav Maga fighters either disarmed or used weapon to defeat attacker.
Darryl S.
Reply:I did as you said and I feel better already. Report It
Reply:keep at least one or two guns at your home.keep them handy,hidden,loaded,and indifferent rooms.one in the bedroom.you need to at least be able to protect your home.
Reply:Kick em in the balls. Quick and effective. Start by standing in a good side stance. legs shoulder width apart, practice lifting your knee as fast as you can. Once you perfect the knee kick, start throwing the leg out behind it. Also, poking people in the eyes, HARD, is another great move.
Reply:1st I will ask you a question .How often do you intend on practicing any moves we might tell you?If not everyday forget it .Your action has to be automatic without any thought to make you hesitate.That takes tons of practice.Your action has to over ride your fear.Practice kicks no more than stomach hi down to the knees .Then practice knee attacks to the groin or stomach.Then practice grab pull and punch go in for a leg tackle.All these things can be practiced on a heavy bag as your opponent
Remember the only true self defense is walk away or run away everything else is fighting whether you started it or not and that is how the law sees it.
Reply:Try a MA school again. Do something different like TKD - schools are everywhere and you should have no trouble finding one.
I say try again because there is nothing that any Yahoos can tell you that will help you with confidence or in a practical application if you were defending yourself. You need to learn the techniques and practice them on a regular basis and in different scenarios in the dojo.
You will learn alot of different techniques to defend yourself, but you will only actually need a few...and luckily enough, those are the ones they teach you first (simple kicks and punches).
Please try it again and really get into it. As you progress your confidence will increase with your abilities. Good luck!
Reply:That won't work. If you don't don't wanna ever actually engage in a fight, you will never be able to effectively defend yourself. hearing about some moves on Yahoo! Answers will not stop some guy from punking you in the middle of the street. So either cowboy the eff up, or continue to cry yourself asleep, but if you do not like to fight you will never actually be able to, should the need arise. And no, do not get any guns. If you cannot find hand to hand, you will not be able to effectively use weapons either. Pull out a gun, the guy will sense your fear, take the gun from you, and then either shoot you or beat you, or both.
Reply:You can still do martial arts, learn some great things, and not be a fighter. If you want to check out some self defense things online, I would suggest youtube, or expertvillage.
http://www.expertvillage.com/interviews/...
http://beauty.expertvillage.com/intervie...
If you plan on using any of these techniques, you have to practice a lot to be able to them on instinct.
Reply:The best, if there is such a thing, self-defense move is simple, yet very hard to do.
Avoid getting yourself into a situation were fighting becomes an issue.
Reply:Having suffered (and I mean suffered!) from low self-esteem and depression all my life I can only add that Stingray is the man to listen to... No 'self defense' move is going to help you if your cringing in a corner with your hands over your face... Try Stingray's advice and if that doesn't work get some professional counselling help... You need to build your ego, not your muscles! ;-) All the very best with it... I do Tae Kwon Do by the way, I'm 'only' a yellow belt (get told off for putting the 'only' all the time... ), but it's getting better all the time... My hubby and my nine year old also do TKD and they are both Blue Belts... (I had a six month break to get through my last depression.. but I'm on their tails!)
What are some good, simple self-defense moves?
You are your own worse enemy in that you are what and how you think you are. You make statements like, ' I am a wuss and a coward." Your subconscious mind says OK, your wish is my command, and you are therefore a wuss and a coward.
With the proper mindset and self confidence which will come from inside after you have re-written your " Rules of Engagement", if you will, you will become a new man, and without the ongoing fear factor, you will find less desire or need for learning an effective fight system. Without the proper mindset and self confidence, Steven Segal would be a wuss and a coward. It is imperative you master these two qualities first, before learning any fight system.
After having done that, get ready for that special woman in your life, as she will soon be there for you.
You can take all the flying lessons in the world, but if you have a fear of flying, all the training will be useless if you cannot apply it.
Start immediately in re-programming your subconscious mind with positive affirmations, Pen and paper, and write statements such as, " I am very self confident". or " Women are attracted to me because of my high level of self confidence". Write each of these affirmations 10 times or more, and do this daily.
Use subliminal programs to re-program your sub conscious mind for a high level of self confidence. When the changes take place on the subconscious level, the changes will come from the inside out without interference from your conscious mind.
After you have gained a respect for yourself, then check out the IDF ( Israeli defense force) fight system, Krav Maga. This is what law enforcement agents learn. You would benefit greatly from enrolling in a training course, or there are highly effective training films available on the Internet.
In summary, start by building your self confidence and mindset and you will find your need for a fight system will have diminished considerably. But if you feel the need, get some Krav Maga training and you will be mentally equiped to fight to the finish and come out the winner whether against CQB ( Close Quarter Battle) hand to hand or weapons attack.
Note: Recently, Body Weapons had a special on Krav Maga and the two trainees who were already trained in many martial arts systems, were totally unequiped to deal with the Krav Maga fighters tactics. This included vicious knife attacks from knife fighting professionals, which Krav Maga fighters either disarmed or used weapon to defeat attacker.
Darryl S.
Reply:I did as you said and I feel better already. Report It
Reply:keep at least one or two guns at your home.keep them handy,hidden,loaded,and indifferent rooms.one in the bedroom.you need to at least be able to protect your home.
Reply:Kick em in the balls. Quick and effective. Start by standing in a good side stance. legs shoulder width apart, practice lifting your knee as fast as you can. Once you perfect the knee kick, start throwing the leg out behind it. Also, poking people in the eyes, HARD, is another great move.
Reply:1st I will ask you a question .How often do you intend on practicing any moves we might tell you?If not everyday forget it .Your action has to be automatic without any thought to make you hesitate.That takes tons of practice.Your action has to over ride your fear.Practice kicks no more than stomach hi down to the knees .Then practice knee attacks to the groin or stomach.Then practice grab pull and punch go in for a leg tackle.All these things can be practiced on a heavy bag as your opponent
Remember the only true self defense is walk away or run away everything else is fighting whether you started it or not and that is how the law sees it.
Reply:Try a MA school again. Do something different like TKD - schools are everywhere and you should have no trouble finding one.
I say try again because there is nothing that any Yahoos can tell you that will help you with confidence or in a practical application if you were defending yourself. You need to learn the techniques and practice them on a regular basis and in different scenarios in the dojo.
You will learn alot of different techniques to defend yourself, but you will only actually need a few...and luckily enough, those are the ones they teach you first (simple kicks and punches).
Please try it again and really get into it. As you progress your confidence will increase with your abilities. Good luck!
Reply:That won't work. If you don't don't wanna ever actually engage in a fight, you will never be able to effectively defend yourself. hearing about some moves on Yahoo! Answers will not stop some guy from punking you in the middle of the street. So either cowboy the eff up, or continue to cry yourself asleep, but if you do not like to fight you will never actually be able to, should the need arise. And no, do not get any guns. If you cannot find hand to hand, you will not be able to effectively use weapons either. Pull out a gun, the guy will sense your fear, take the gun from you, and then either shoot you or beat you, or both.
Reply:You can still do martial arts, learn some great things, and not be a fighter. If you want to check out some self defense things online, I would suggest youtube, or expertvillage.
http://www.expertvillage.com/interviews/...
http://beauty.expertvillage.com/intervie...
If you plan on using any of these techniques, you have to practice a lot to be able to them on instinct.
Reply:The best, if there is such a thing, self-defense move is simple, yet very hard to do.
Avoid getting yourself into a situation were fighting becomes an issue.
Reply:Having suffered (and I mean suffered!) from low self-esteem and depression all my life I can only add that Stingray is the man to listen to... No 'self defense' move is going to help you if your cringing in a corner with your hands over your face... Try Stingray's advice and if that doesn't work get some professional counselling help... You need to build your ego, not your muscles! ;-) All the very best with it... I do Tae Kwon Do by the way, I'm 'only' a yellow belt (get told off for putting the 'only' all the time... ), but it's getting better all the time... My hubby and my nine year old also do TKD and they are both Blue Belts... (I had a six month break to get through my last depression.. but I'm on their tails!)
Bruce Lee & David Carradine in the early 70´s, was a racist decision by hollywood?
what do u think of that? According to interviews with Chuck Norris %26amp; Bruce´s widow - Linda Lee Caldwell in 2002
Bruce Lee was screwed out of the "Kungfu TV show" because it was Bruce Lee's idea to make this show so the producers felt that the american producers wasn't ready for an asian actor. Does it occur to yeah that Bruce Lee had another TV show called the green hornet it was a american TV show. So after Bruce Lee got stiff for this project producers went out and got David Carradine.Carradine couldn't even fight really, he didn't know anything about Kung Fu.
PS: Nowadays Hollywood put the name of the late Bruce into the "HOLLYWOOD WALK OF FAME" besides James Dean %26amp; Marilyn Monroe.
Bruce Lee %26amp; David Carradine in the early 70´s, was a racist decision by hollywood?
It is true that David Carradine was not a martial artist previous to the show "Kung Fu". Since then, though, he has become quite an accomplished martial artist.
No question that the reason Bruce Lee was not cast as a lead in a movie or television show in the 60's was due to racism. In fact, according to interviews and books I have read, he got the part of Kato due to the fact he wears a mask and his eyes could appear more round.
While I think this is all horrible, I can't pass judgment on events that happened 30-40 years ago with today's value standards. In all honesty, the producers of TV shows want to have high ratings so that advertisers will pay more for time slots during the shows. At that time, even in our great country, people may not have been ready for a strong Asian lead character.
It is sad to think though, that even just a few short years later that "Enter the Dragon" had such success with a strong Asian lead who was tragically taken from us at what should have been the height of his success. When we were finally ready, Bruce Lee was gone...
Reply:Excellent answer Steel!! :) Report It
Reply:Yes it was a racist decision
Reply:Definitely a racist decision. A Chinese person, or a person of any other color than white, could not be a lead in a show in the U.S. He was Kato in "The Green Hornet", but only because it wasn't the lead.
I believe that the lack of a true kung fu star allowed the success of such martial arts shams as Chuck Norris and Jean Claude Van Damme.
Today, we're lucky to have Jackie Chan and Jet Li to elevate the standard of kung fu in U.S. movies.
Reply:prejudice that is all it was ,by the way bruce lee , although he stole the show in the green hornet wasn't the star of the show but a trusty side kick. It took a success of 'enter the dragon' to establish him as a true international star ,ironically dying almost simultaneouly to it's release!
Reply:who ever gave you all of that info is full of bs historically lee and carradine are equals, both went to the same shaolin academy at the same time, when the time for the show parts to be given out, lee was busy making a movie in singapore, the producers would not wait, gave it to carradine,, incdently his father john had a lot of pull in the final cut
Reply:What do you expect from a country that had slaves and the Klu Klax Klan its predjudiced beliefs are still around in some states. Did you see the films Easy Rider, or Bury my Heart at Wounded Knee, I could go on, but why bother !!
Furniture
Bruce Lee was screwed out of the "Kungfu TV show" because it was Bruce Lee's idea to make this show so the producers felt that the american producers wasn't ready for an asian actor. Does it occur to yeah that Bruce Lee had another TV show called the green hornet it was a american TV show. So after Bruce Lee got stiff for this project producers went out and got David Carradine.Carradine couldn't even fight really, he didn't know anything about Kung Fu.
PS: Nowadays Hollywood put the name of the late Bruce into the "HOLLYWOOD WALK OF FAME" besides James Dean %26amp; Marilyn Monroe.
Bruce Lee %26amp; David Carradine in the early 70´s, was a racist decision by hollywood?
It is true that David Carradine was not a martial artist previous to the show "Kung Fu". Since then, though, he has become quite an accomplished martial artist.
No question that the reason Bruce Lee was not cast as a lead in a movie or television show in the 60's was due to racism. In fact, according to interviews and books I have read, he got the part of Kato due to the fact he wears a mask and his eyes could appear more round.
While I think this is all horrible, I can't pass judgment on events that happened 30-40 years ago with today's value standards. In all honesty, the producers of TV shows want to have high ratings so that advertisers will pay more for time slots during the shows. At that time, even in our great country, people may not have been ready for a strong Asian lead character.
It is sad to think though, that even just a few short years later that "Enter the Dragon" had such success with a strong Asian lead who was tragically taken from us at what should have been the height of his success. When we were finally ready, Bruce Lee was gone...
Reply:Excellent answer Steel!! :) Report It
Reply:Yes it was a racist decision
Reply:Definitely a racist decision. A Chinese person, or a person of any other color than white, could not be a lead in a show in the U.S. He was Kato in "The Green Hornet", but only because it wasn't the lead.
I believe that the lack of a true kung fu star allowed the success of such martial arts shams as Chuck Norris and Jean Claude Van Damme.
Today, we're lucky to have Jackie Chan and Jet Li to elevate the standard of kung fu in U.S. movies.
Reply:prejudice that is all it was ,by the way bruce lee , although he stole the show in the green hornet wasn't the star of the show but a trusty side kick. It took a success of 'enter the dragon' to establish him as a true international star ,ironically dying almost simultaneouly to it's release!
Reply:who ever gave you all of that info is full of bs historically lee and carradine are equals, both went to the same shaolin academy at the same time, when the time for the show parts to be given out, lee was busy making a movie in singapore, the producers would not wait, gave it to carradine,, incdently his father john had a lot of pull in the final cut
Reply:What do you expect from a country that had slaves and the Klu Klax Klan its predjudiced beliefs are still around in some states. Did you see the films Easy Rider, or Bury my Heart at Wounded Knee, I could go on, but why bother !!
Furniture
Bruce Lee & David Carradine in the early 70´s, was a racist decision by hollywood?
According to interviews with Chuck Norris %26amp; Bruce´s widow - Linda Lee Caldwell in 2002
Bruce Lee was screwed out of the "Kungfu TV show" because it was Bruce Lee's idea to make this show so the producers felt that the american producers wasn't ready for an asian actor. Does it occur to yeah that Bruce Lee had another TV show called the green hornet it was a american TV show. So after Bruce Lee got stiff for this project producers went out and got David Carradine he can't even fight really, he doesn't know anything about Kung Fu.
what do you think of that ?
Bruce Lee %26amp; David Carradine in the early 70´s, was a racist decision by hollywood?
True // They Cheated Bruce Out Of Doing The Tv Show Kung Fu
1971 - December 7 (Age 31): Hong Kong - Bruce receives telegram, notifying him that he had not been chosen for the part in the upcoming series, The Warrior. This series was later released as Kung-Fu, staring David Carradine, who doesn't know anything about martial arts. (The show aired as ABC-TVs Movie of the Week on February 21, 1972.)
Reply:new one to me I didn't know that !
Bruce Lee was screwed out of the "Kungfu TV show" because it was Bruce Lee's idea to make this show so the producers felt that the american producers wasn't ready for an asian actor. Does it occur to yeah that Bruce Lee had another TV show called the green hornet it was a american TV show. So after Bruce Lee got stiff for this project producers went out and got David Carradine he can't even fight really, he doesn't know anything about Kung Fu.
what do you think of that ?
Bruce Lee %26amp; David Carradine in the early 70´s, was a racist decision by hollywood?
True // They Cheated Bruce Out Of Doing The Tv Show Kung Fu
1971 - December 7 (Age 31): Hong Kong - Bruce receives telegram, notifying him that he had not been chosen for the part in the upcoming series, The Warrior. This series was later released as Kung-Fu, staring David Carradine, who doesn't know anything about martial arts. (The show aired as ABC-TVs Movie of the Week on February 21, 1972.)
Reply:new one to me I didn't know that !
Do you consider MMA, PRIDE, and UFC a sport or a game?
Anyone catch those thugged out Geico cavemen look-a-likes on these reality "fighting" shows? They seem to be on everyday now. These undisciplined punks. Kung Fu is a sport, Tae Kwon Do is a sport, Golf is a sport, watching these pigs fight is not a sport, it is a game, much like the Xbox 360 because it takes no skill to throw wild haymakers and roll on the floor twisting someone's arm trying to make them cry 'uncle'.
Where is the skill and the athletic ability? There is none. Why do these guys waste all the hours in the day doing this? It makes me sad. They might as well play checkers, magic the gathering, or shuffle board. Its all the same thing. Its a game, not a sport.
Does anyone else agree with me? I'd rather watch curling or my nephew playing the Wii, because its basically the same thing as what these "athletes" do.
Do you consider MMA, PRIDE, and UFC a sport or a game?
These events should be considered in the arena of extreme sports.
Unlike the staged theatrics and soap opera of WCW and similar venues; the guys who participate in the MMA, PRIDE, and UFC are actual fighters.
Martial Art styles (Kung Fu, Karate, Tang Su Do, Judo, Jujitsu, Kempo, Akido, etc) were not developed as a "sport" but were developed as actual combat and war-fighting methods.
Tae Kwon Do is a sport (it was developed from Tang So Do) and as most of the Martial Arts community can vouch for it is something which everyone can do and no one gets hurt; but it was designed with that in mind. I have seen Tae Kwon Do practitioners completely dominate and defeat undisciplined people in fights. One individual defeated four guys in a matter of about 45 seconds.
Judo is a sport, however, I have seen some of the worst injuries not from kick-boxing but from Judo matchs, broken arms, legs, necks, dislocated joints are very comon. A guy who knows Judo is a very dangerous person indeed.
In real Martial Arts the warrior who knew the most usually had a much better chance of surviving an actual conflict.
Your analysis of a bunch of brutes throwing each other around is completely uneducated, misinformed, and wrong. Militaries, Law Enforcement, and all sorts of goverrnment agencies world-wide pay billions of dollars each year in order to train their men in such combat scenarios and systems. The reason they do this is because it works and it saves lives.
With that part being said, I think that the current craze of so-called exteme fighting has greatly detracted from the pure sport of fighting and has lessened and cheapened the respect and credibility of fighting systems. They are no longer contests to see which is better and how to learn but unmercifull bloodsport with trash talking.
lilycare
Where is the skill and the athletic ability? There is none. Why do these guys waste all the hours in the day doing this? It makes me sad. They might as well play checkers, magic the gathering, or shuffle board. Its all the same thing. Its a game, not a sport.
Does anyone else agree with me? I'd rather watch curling or my nephew playing the Wii, because its basically the same thing as what these "athletes" do.
Do you consider MMA, PRIDE, and UFC a sport or a game?
These events should be considered in the arena of extreme sports.
Unlike the staged theatrics and soap opera of WCW and similar venues; the guys who participate in the MMA, PRIDE, and UFC are actual fighters.
Martial Art styles (Kung Fu, Karate, Tang Su Do, Judo, Jujitsu, Kempo, Akido, etc) were not developed as a "sport" but were developed as actual combat and war-fighting methods.
Tae Kwon Do is a sport (it was developed from Tang So Do) and as most of the Martial Arts community can vouch for it is something which everyone can do and no one gets hurt; but it was designed with that in mind. I have seen Tae Kwon Do practitioners completely dominate and defeat undisciplined people in fights. One individual defeated four guys in a matter of about 45 seconds.
Judo is a sport, however, I have seen some of the worst injuries not from kick-boxing but from Judo matchs, broken arms, legs, necks, dislocated joints are very comon. A guy who knows Judo is a very dangerous person indeed.
In real Martial Arts the warrior who knew the most usually had a much better chance of surviving an actual conflict.
Your analysis of a bunch of brutes throwing each other around is completely uneducated, misinformed, and wrong. Militaries, Law Enforcement, and all sorts of goverrnment agencies world-wide pay billions of dollars each year in order to train their men in such combat scenarios and systems. The reason they do this is because it works and it saves lives.
With that part being said, I think that the current craze of so-called exteme fighting has greatly detracted from the pure sport of fighting and has lessened and cheapened the respect and credibility of fighting systems. They are no longer contests to see which is better and how to learn but unmercifull bloodsport with trash talking.
lilycare
Twin brothers ... Funny or not...?
Twin brothers in their mom's womb are having a conversation.
One says to the other: " I want to invent a light bulb when I grow up, it's so dark here."
The other one says : " I want to learn Kung Fu when I grow up, so I can fight that bald guy who always puts his head in and spit on me. "
Please give a star if you think it's funny.
Twin brothers ... Funny or not...?
no star...gross
Reply:ok here is your star
Reply:its okay...
Reply:eww, wow
Reply:Oh, Lord that is HILARIOUS. Very nice. OK, you get a star.
Reply:hahaha legend - i'll give u a star ;)
Reply:it was ok, not the funny ,so no star sorry
Reply:good one.
star.
Reply:Ha Ha! Funny! 10!
Reply:dont get it
One says to the other: " I want to invent a light bulb when I grow up, it's so dark here."
The other one says : " I want to learn Kung Fu when I grow up, so I can fight that bald guy who always puts his head in and spit on me. "
Please give a star if you think it's funny.
Twin brothers ... Funny or not...?
no star...gross
Reply:ok here is your star
Reply:its okay...
Reply:eww, wow
Reply:Oh, Lord that is HILARIOUS. Very nice. OK, you get a star.
Reply:hahaha legend - i'll give u a star ;)
Reply:it was ok, not the funny ,so no star sorry
Reply:good one.
star.
Reply:Ha Ha! Funny! 10!
Reply:dont get it
How can i make a pair of tonfas and combat fans?
im a kung-fu and martial arts fanatic and i wanna learn basically ever fighting style know to man kind but mainly weapon styles lol :P so can someone tell me how to make a pair of tonfas and combat fans? im very egar to hear a awnser lol thanks to whoever posts a answer ^^
How can i make a pair of tonfas and combat fans?
1) Borrow examples from a friend or work from photos.
2) Measure them and make up a drawing
3) Buy some material %26amp; supplies
4) Cut,sand,drill,glue,assemble,%26amp; stain your projects
5) Enjoy your copies.
Reply:Really, if you want sets of these weapons, your best bet is to buy them rather than to make them. It's not likely you're going to find a step-by-step instruction manual on the Internet on how to create such weapons. You can buy these from many different martial arts supply websites, although I recommend someone like Ed Green from Budo Weapons, since he handmakes everything to a high degree of quality. The problem is that he's so backed up on orders right now that you could wind up waiting a year or so to receive yours. If you don't want to wait that long, look around, visit www.awma.com or one of the other more popular supply stores online and see what's available.
If you're dead-set on making some yourself, it's going to take a long time of practice, study, trial and error to get it right. You might be able to buy some manuals somewhere that teach you how to make them...but I wouldn't have the first clue where to look.
How can i make a pair of tonfas and combat fans?
1) Borrow examples from a friend or work from photos.
2) Measure them and make up a drawing
3) Buy some material %26amp; supplies
4) Cut,sand,drill,glue,assemble,%26amp; stain your projects
5) Enjoy your copies.
Reply:Really, if you want sets of these weapons, your best bet is to buy them rather than to make them. It's not likely you're going to find a step-by-step instruction manual on the Internet on how to create such weapons. You can buy these from many different martial arts supply websites, although I recommend someone like Ed Green from Budo Weapons, since he handmakes everything to a high degree of quality. The problem is that he's so backed up on orders right now that you could wind up waiting a year or so to receive yours. If you don't want to wait that long, look around, visit www.awma.com or one of the other more popular supply stores online and see what's available.
If you're dead-set on making some yourself, it's going to take a long time of practice, study, trial and error to get it right. You might be able to buy some manuals somewhere that teach you how to make them...but I wouldn't have the first clue where to look.
Dont you guys agree Mike tyson was one of the greatest fighters in the world?
a bunch of you internet people always preach to me on how to be , humble and cool headed in a fight , like that bullcrap you see in kung fu movies and ****. well how about mike tyson , you cant argue that he was not one of the most feared and dominate fighters to ever walk the planet.
Dont you guys agree Mike tyson was one of the greatest fighters in the world?
the whole point of being humble is that no matter how big and bad you are there's always someone who can beat you, or at least have a chance of beating you.
but no doubt mike tyson was a great BOXER definitely would beat me. but then again by being humble i would most likely not be in a situation to fight him in the first place
if you walk around with a chip on your shoulder its only a matter of time before someone knocks you down to size
Reply:he is terrible
Reply:Very tough guy,no doubt.
There is more to being popular then just being big,scary,and hard to beat.
I really liked Sugar Ray Leonard,so did "Everyone else"
There is more to being "Well Liked" than winning.
Reply:First off tyson wasnt a fighter yes he was labeled boxer and had 1 punch knockout power but I guarantee against prob hundreds of other fighters he would not last longer than 10 min not to mention a lot of the guys who beat knocked out whatever were nobodies and has beens and discipline is everything being methodical and calculated is even better than having the 1 punch knock out power because great fighters can take a punch not mention submit you choke you out or knock you out with hands or feet
tyson probably isnt even a top 20 boxer of all time or prob a top 10 heavyweight for that matter
Reply:When I hear Tyson's name I can only think of this famous saying... "The brightest flame burns quickest."
1) Tyson was a monster and completely dominant during his prime.
He had it all when he was focused; speed, power, aggressiveness, intimidation, defense (great head movement), conditioning, great body punching, and he threw punches in combinations.
It was only after everyone from the early days were gone and he was surrounded by Don King and sychophants that he lost focus, stopped training, and became a shadow of his former self.
2) He fought the best competition available in his prime. Spinks was still recognized by many as the true HW champ and was considered a true threat to Mike... Right up until about 91 seconds into the first round. Larry Holmes was a great former champion and went on to have a very good 2nd career beating legitimate contenders like Ray Mercer.
Yes Tyson may not have had the greatest competition to face but it was the best available in the 80's. Is that Mike's fault? Of course not, but some want to point to this as a reason why Tyson was so over-rated.
3) Many claim that Mike's short lived prime show's he was over-rated. But when you look at boxing history that just doesn't stand up to facts...
Tyson despite all his natural speed and great defence (and yes in his prime he did have a great defense) was a puncher. A look back at history shows that no puncher had a very long prime or title reign. Foreman, Marciano, Dempsey... All had short reigns as champion. The longest being Dempsey who during a 6 year riegn fought... 6 times(!) before losing to Tunney. And even Marciano who was undefeated (and has been berated for having lackluster competition) only had a 3 year run...
As exciting as punchers are to watch once they've been "figured out" they are effectively out of their prime. Not one has ever regained the HW title. And in Tyson's case this was sped up by his loss of focus after all his original camp was swept away.
Tyson was great in his day but he was never gonna have a long prime no matter what...
Dont you guys agree Mike tyson was one of the greatest fighters in the world?
the whole point of being humble is that no matter how big and bad you are there's always someone who can beat you, or at least have a chance of beating you.
but no doubt mike tyson was a great BOXER definitely would beat me. but then again by being humble i would most likely not be in a situation to fight him in the first place
if you walk around with a chip on your shoulder its only a matter of time before someone knocks you down to size
Reply:he is terrible
Reply:Very tough guy,no doubt.
There is more to being popular then just being big,scary,and hard to beat.
I really liked Sugar Ray Leonard,so did "Everyone else"
There is more to being "Well Liked" than winning.
Reply:First off tyson wasnt a fighter yes he was labeled boxer and had 1 punch knockout power but I guarantee against prob hundreds of other fighters he would not last longer than 10 min not to mention a lot of the guys who beat knocked out whatever were nobodies and has beens and discipline is everything being methodical and calculated is even better than having the 1 punch knock out power because great fighters can take a punch not mention submit you choke you out or knock you out with hands or feet
tyson probably isnt even a top 20 boxer of all time or prob a top 10 heavyweight for that matter
Reply:When I hear Tyson's name I can only think of this famous saying... "The brightest flame burns quickest."
1) Tyson was a monster and completely dominant during his prime.
He had it all when he was focused; speed, power, aggressiveness, intimidation, defense (great head movement), conditioning, great body punching, and he threw punches in combinations.
It was only after everyone from the early days were gone and he was surrounded by Don King and sychophants that he lost focus, stopped training, and became a shadow of his former self.
2) He fought the best competition available in his prime. Spinks was still recognized by many as the true HW champ and was considered a true threat to Mike... Right up until about 91 seconds into the first round. Larry Holmes was a great former champion and went on to have a very good 2nd career beating legitimate contenders like Ray Mercer.
Yes Tyson may not have had the greatest competition to face but it was the best available in the 80's. Is that Mike's fault? Of course not, but some want to point to this as a reason why Tyson was so over-rated.
3) Many claim that Mike's short lived prime show's he was over-rated. But when you look at boxing history that just doesn't stand up to facts...
Tyson despite all his natural speed and great defence (and yes in his prime he did have a great defense) was a puncher. A look back at history shows that no puncher had a very long prime or title reign. Foreman, Marciano, Dempsey... All had short reigns as champion. The longest being Dempsey who during a 6 year riegn fought... 6 times(!) before losing to Tunney. And even Marciano who was undefeated (and has been berated for having lackluster competition) only had a 3 year run...
As exciting as punchers are to watch once they've been "figured out" they are effectively out of their prime. Not one has ever regained the HW title. And in Tyson's case this was sped up by his loss of focus after all his original camp was swept away.
Tyson was great in his day but he was never gonna have a long prime no matter what...
Need help with new book can't decide which to write?
i'm wanting to start writting a new book but i have three subjects to write about
one is called kung fu girls about five girls from five continents who are master kung fu fighters who join together and enter a world wide fighting compitention who then break up to destroy each other after the leader of the tricks them in to thicking they all sould each other out after making a bet to their arch rivals the Dem smokers clique
the second is called called town of tice a hip hop version of the 1978 jonestwon mass murder sucide which takes place in brazil when a large group of the hip hop communty moves there from los angelous after americas bands major record labels from putting out rap albums with explict lyrics
the thrid is a fantacy story and the a abot two twin sisters who where raised by two seperate familes living in a modern mid evil like middle earth where they are orderd to kill each other familes buy their great lord
which one do you think is best?
Need help with new book can't decide which to write?
First, you have to get a more careful eye. Watch out for your spelling and grammar errors. =)
Um ... I like the Kung Fu Girls story out of all those. Although I wouldn't name their rivals that. I would give them a more kung-fu-ish name.
Good luck, remember, watch your spelling and grammar. And be patient, don't rush anything. =)
Reply:Its not my book to write. Your supposed to be the writer. You may wont to consider something else.
Reply:im a writer too and i usually write three subjects at once and just keep writing on the one that really flows
Reply:ur the writer but i would say the fantasy story because that my favorite genre but all 3 of them sound good
watch the spelling and grammer
the 1st story was hard to understand about the leader
Reply:You should take some English grammar lessons,it will serve you well in the future.
one is called kung fu girls about five girls from five continents who are master kung fu fighters who join together and enter a world wide fighting compitention who then break up to destroy each other after the leader of the tricks them in to thicking they all sould each other out after making a bet to their arch rivals the Dem smokers clique
the second is called called town of tice a hip hop version of the 1978 jonestwon mass murder sucide which takes place in brazil when a large group of the hip hop communty moves there from los angelous after americas bands major record labels from putting out rap albums with explict lyrics
the thrid is a fantacy story and the a abot two twin sisters who where raised by two seperate familes living in a modern mid evil like middle earth where they are orderd to kill each other familes buy their great lord
which one do you think is best?
Need help with new book can't decide which to write?
First, you have to get a more careful eye. Watch out for your spelling and grammar errors. =)
Um ... I like the Kung Fu Girls story out of all those. Although I wouldn't name their rivals that. I would give them a more kung-fu-ish name.
Good luck, remember, watch your spelling and grammar. And be patient, don't rush anything. =)
Reply:Its not my book to write. Your supposed to be the writer. You may wont to consider something else.
Reply:im a writer too and i usually write three subjects at once and just keep writing on the one that really flows
Reply:ur the writer but i would say the fantasy story because that my favorite genre but all 3 of them sound good
watch the spelling and grammer
the 1st story was hard to understand about the leader
Reply:You should take some English grammar lessons,it will serve you well in the future.
Are these martial arts effective at all in a street fight?
taekwondo - i really dont see how kicking someone will win you a fight never mind an experienced fighter but even against a bumb on the street. but if you can elaborate please tell me how it is effective. same goes for kenpo karate, kung fu and boxing.
for me i belive if you fight more than two attackers you wont possibly win. this is why i think brazilian jujitsu will serve as self defense as will judo, sambo, amateur wrestling and a few other styles but they are not practiced often. more often than not its the least effective arts that are taught that you cannot you in a defensive situation.
why is this?
Are these martial arts effective at all in a street fight?
I don't believe in ineffective styles.
I believe in ineffective training methods.
Any style, technique is simply a tool in your tool belt, you have to learn of it's effectiveness for you, or ineffectiveness. By large and large Judo is considered an "effective" art by most standards. However that doesn't mean every single throw is combat effective, or even effective for a person. A great Judoka has maybe 2 or 3 throws that he can do at any angle, without fail.
A world champion boxer has maybe one or two good punches that he can hit accurately with knock out power with regularity.
The same with all fighters, they have an arsenal of a bunch of moves, but perfect a few, they have a style based on that.
But the only way you learn those things is through combat, sparring, hard resistent alive training against opponents who are attempting to do the same to you. That is where you develop what works for you and what doesn't.
I don't believe in writing a whole style off, there are proven techniques in nearly all the styles, but I will quickly write off any training approach that does not train with resistance and alive hard sparring. Until you can perform a technique on an individual repeatedly who is trying to prevent you from doing so, you don't truly have grasp of that technique.
Additionally until you have done so under adrenaline, you truly aren't effective either. I have seen guys who are dojo bad@sses, that can wipe the floor with everyone they face, but the second they get in a ring, cage, or tournament suddenly they just suck. Similarly I have seen guys do horrible in the dojo or gym, and see them just destroy guys in tournaments, cages, and rings.
I think a lot of people discount actual instincts, and think for some reason that because a person does this or this, that they some how won't have basic human instinct.
News Flash: Wrestlers, Judokas, BJJer, Samboist, all can punch as well. They can all throw fists, and do what comes natural to humans for combat. They are just more skilled once it comes to a grappling or in close portion.
I think that anything in which you can actively spar heavy and hard with, and get a chance to compete in against a stranger gives you a distinct advantage in adrenaline based situations.
The truth is the best techniques are simple, and they are in every art in some form. Every art has a punches, kicks, etc.
They may vary how they do it, but they all have it.
There are techniques from any art you can incorporate into your repetoire and make effective. But only is made effective by actually doing it at full speed, at full intensity, with regularity.
Simple fact is I HIGHLY doubt you "fight in a cage" because your ideas are flawed towards ONLY grappling. A boxer would DESTROY a bum on the street.
I am not sure where you get BJJ, Judo, and Amateur wrestling aren't practiced often. Practically every High School in the US, England, and the civilized world has a Wrestling team. Judo is EVERYWHERE. BJJ might be harder to find, but not so much. I can see how Sambo might be thought of as less practiced.
Also if you don't see how leg kicks, body kicks, liver kicks, knees, elbows, and fists won't help you in a fight, on the street. Well then you are a lost cause.
Grappling is just one range of fighting, and mind you can close the distance and get to it quickly. However that doesn't discount the need to know effective striking.
Again, this comes from actually striking, not from forms, not from bags, not from point sparring, and tippy tap sparring. But from hard sparring, and practicing those skills as close to a fully adrenalized situation as possible.
Grappling gives you the bonus of being able to train at full speed, full intensity, and having lesser chance for injury. It's VERY effective training, but there is also very effective striking.
More importantly, there is striking defense that has to be learned, if you grapple only and rarely have shots thrown at you, you have no idea how much you can actually get hurt, how an open guard is punishment, and how being turtled is one of the worst positions you can be in.
Again, I think you need to know all phases of unnarmed combat, and know them effectively, by effectively training. I don't think this is an art specific problem, I think this is a training problem. I think most arts specialize in one area, and rightly so. You should learn from those specialist, then cross train with other specialist, and become a well rounded fighter.
I don't think one art can show you everything, because there are nuances to each phase that you can only get from specializing in it. Additionally techniques that could be effective for your body style, or traits are left out.
For example:
Take Judo: There are 67 some odd official throws, hundreds of variations. In general Osoto Gari, Seionage, Uechi Mata, are some of the more used throws.
However there are literally hundreds of ways to throw these throws. An art that combines striking, throws, ground work, might show you one or two ways to throw these throws, and none of them could be the most effective for you. But also, they leave out literally hundreds of other throws aside from these that could be a better suit for you.
The only way to really know what throws work for you, and the various ways of throwing them is to go to a Judo place and work.
Everyone has their own style, their own techniques that work better for their build and their abilities. With effective alive training they can find them, they can develop timing, they can see the reactions, know openings, know how and when to use a technique and how when to NOT use a particular technique.
I believe in training methods, not specific arts. I won't write off an entire art, because it could have stuff I can use. I will write off a place that doesn't train effectively or realistically, and attempts to disguise this by saying it is too dangerous or secretive.
Well that is my take, to be effective you need to be well rounded. You don't have to be the best at any one thing, but you should be able to defend yourself in any range of combat.
If you neglect one area, then you are weak in that area, and in turn weak to defend against it.
You don't have to be the best boxer in the world, but you better know how to defend against good boxing. The same with grappling. YOu don't have to be a submission expert, but you damn sure better be competent with defending them, and the requires a high level of familiarity of them. Familiarity you get from sparring at that range against skilled opponents and recognizing the common set ups, and feeling when they are going for it.
It's not about arts, or even individuals (though athleticism and natural talent do have a say in matters) it is about effective training and developing your own style, knowing what works for you and what doesn't, and any possible thing that can be thrown at you, at least to the competency of how to defend against it.
That is just my opinion.
Reply:they ''re only effective if the combat is between two individuals ^^
Reply:No!
Martial arts are not for street fights!
Street fights are an illegal and, quite frankly, stupid activity. If you keep getting into them, sooner or later, you'll cross the wrong person. The wrong person is either a) A hardened criminal who won't think twice about using a deadly weapon. b) A mugger who wants to get you isolated so his friends can jump you and get your valuables c) A crazed drug addict or mental health patient who doesn't have an "off" switch once they go off. d) A sociopath who doesn't care how he wins, as long as he does (again, weapons)... A number of other scenarios come to mind.
Martial arts in street fights is the stuff of movies. In real life, street fighting is about violence, plain and simple - about attempting to submit and incapacitate another person. If you're lucky enough to be doing this with a person who has the same idea as you about what's acceptable and what's not in a "fair" fight, but sooner or later, you're going to get into a scuffle with someone who has no such notion. By the time you realize this, it may be too late and you may be living your last moments on earth, or about to be disabled for life.
And if you keep playing tough and street-fighting, it's not a question of IF this will happen, but WHEN. This is not high school anymore and it certainly isn't the movies. With any luck, martial arts will give you the wisdom to walk away from this kind of macho idiocy.
Now self-defence is another issue. Self-defence and fighting are not the same. Any martial art is good for self-defence. Their main benifit is confidence and awareness - two skills that have more to do with survival than any "technique". Your first concern if assaulted should not be to win - but to get out of the situation. Call in help if you can. Run if that's open to you. Staying there and mixing it up with a violent person is just asking for trouble and trouble will find you sooner or later.
No you don't.
If you're such an expert (a professional no less!), why are you asking us?
Reply:Off course these are effective in your daily life. I'm taking karate class and we are learning the most important thing: self defense. It also teaches us how to fight 1to1, 1to2, and 1to3. Once I was attacked by 2 people and I defended myself. Those techniques were very much helpful.
Reply:Martial arts is a defensive protection and should only be used for protection, but it is based on your abilities and skills. Once you acquired the experience and skills doesn't mean you can whip any one. It means you'll be able to protect yourself.
Once heard (quote)"that with great power,comes great responsibility"(unquote) Martial art is a tool, just like a gun or knife. You use it irresponsible you'll hurt yourself or someone else. You need to investigate the art you wish to master and once you started some classes you'll gain the confidence to excel.
ie..........
Martial art whether gained from jujitsu or taekwondo was intended for self defense and not for running down the other guy and kicking his *ss, to do so has made you the attacker, and subject to the laws or civil actions that occur. One should not seek marital art to improve his performance in the "ring".
Reply:When I was 3 months into training in American Karate, I learned that who wins in a fight is dependent upon the individual himself or herself. I've met people who trained regularly and are easily beaten in a contest. And I've met people with no formal martial arts training who (I feel) were very intimidating. I don't feel it's the Style of martial arts that matters, but the intensity in your training, and how badly do you want to win (in competitive tournaments, or defending yourself on the street). Definitely, try out the style (or club) that your considering joining. If they do not allow you to sit-in on classes for a week, or at least 3 days, then walk away. Important points: How the Instructor(s) relate to the student(s), how good are the facilities, what is stressed in the teaching (Forms and/or applied techniques as in Sparring), what is it you want to get from the training. I thought I just wanted to look Kool with high-jumping, high kicking movements, but found I appreciated developing confidence in myself was what I really wanted.
Reply:the problem most people have is that they don't see the difference between by the book martial arts and straight fighting.
The original martial arts were taught as an instrument of self defense. They used all the tricks in the book (the dirty ones too) to defend themselves against agression. Of course as training became organised inevitably there had to be a system of rules and restrictions to keep students from beating each other to a bloody pulp every class. Problem with many modern MA is that these rules have been so embedded that people forget to look towards realism and sometimes are so stuck to their pure style that against some one who's "been taught from another book" they are useless. Wide knowledge , experience and a sence of realism are what makes for a good and useable form of martial art.
Reply:Dude, martial arts don't fight. It's the person that fights. Just because you train in a martial art, doesn't mean that you have to fight exactly like that.
Another thing too, the NAME of the art itself is a lifeless concept and it's up to YOU to bring the concept to life.
Like Taekwondo for instance, it means way of the fist and foot. Does that mean that you have to use high flashy kicks? NO. Just because your instructor does it, doesn't mean yu have to as well. Your instructor is their as a purpose JUST TO GET YOU STARTED. He lays the basics down for you. After that, it's up to you to modify the techniques to suit you better.
So to answer your question, it's all about the techniques and strategies that YOU YOURSELF uses. This is when it becomes YOUR OWN martial art, and the techniques that you picked up from training will then become JUST techniques. Not Kenpo techniques, or BJJ techniques, etc.
That's the way how martial arts REALLY supposed to work.
Oh and another thing. You got the wrong idea about ground grappling working for multiple attackers. If you stand there and grapple with someone and then go to the ground with him, that is a dangerous and stupid mistake for you. The best thing to do is to stay on your feet and strike as long as you can, because once you're on the ground, you are either going to get cut up, busted up, or pummeled to death by your attacker and not to mention his/her friends if he has any around.
You also got the wrong idea about striking not working for one on one situations. That's bull. You are more at risk grappling with your opponent than you are with striking. I'd rather fire a rapid combination of strikes at my opponent, knowing that i'm going to hurt him for sure, rather than grapple with him, when hurting him is not always the case.
THINK.
Reply:In a street fight, is all out as everyone knows
-my friend's been in quite a lot
The best form of martial arts are Chinese Martial Arts, Tae Kwon Do is only to get the threat away from u
but chinese martial arts has many MANY forms. I'm currently learning the five ancient styles and it really works in a all out street fight. Chinese Martial arts is the most likely to success against more then 1 opponent
The styles u listed on ur question, they are just 1 form and not multiple forms. Good fighters hav more then 1 styles
I hav Tai Chi fists, Judo, and White Crane Fists
o
and my master foughts against 42 people at once haha
its possible if master multiple forms
good luck on the streets (just make sure there's witnesses)
Reply:Yeah. These are all effective in a street fight. To varying degrees. Each has strengths and weaknesses. If you're a master at any of those styles, and have enough understanding of specific attack methods of your opponent, (or plural) you can be amazingly effective. (i.e. how to avoid takedowns, or get out of an armbar, or dodge a quick jab)
Reply:Beating them to a pulp only teaches them to find easier game not change their stupid ways.So everytime you beat one of these nitwits some other poor bugger is going to pay for it or his girl freind /wife/kids.
May not be your problem but from what I have read in your post you dont seem to have much of a social concience anyway and would rather massage your vanity and call it pride.
Reply:TKD- worthless, the helpful kicks come later on in the training, require good physical strenght and constant practice.
Kenpo- really good, focuses on punches, kicks, self defense situations and judo moves. For the physical aspect you won't be able to do good kicks after you stop studying, but you still have the punches and the throws which do not require physical strenght or constant training.
Karate- good but requires you to be physical fit.
Kungfu- same as karate
Boxing- very good but requires top physical strenght
Brazilian Juijitsu - best for 1v1 does not require physical strenght. But is weak against multiple opponents.
Reply:Yes martial arts could be used in a street fight i learned how to make someone "forget how to breath" and when i was being jumped at a party i used it on one of the guys and his friends took of But i also knew how to get him breathing again. And for TKD if u don't think that one swift kick to the head isn't going to take him down then u better start another style because ur obviosly not trained enough
Reply:head kicking is not safe for fighting outside the dojo or tournaments. anyone thinking otherwise is a fool. the timing and accuracy it requires (not to mention loose clothing) goes out the window when you start to have the fine motor skill shut down when adrenaline hits home.
people who run in gangs fight all the time and protect their heads, so what good is a head kick when they charge in and cut off your only weapon? point sparring wont help train anyone for fighting outside of point sparring.
so TKD is out.
Reply:"I really don't see how kicking someone will win you a fight "
This statement doesn't make sense.
I have "personally" won 70+% of my fights with kicks to the midsection/solar plexus. "Any" experienced fighter knows this.
Is this question just to stir things up?
As for Kenpo,"every" Martial Artist on this site agrees that Kenpo is a good system.
I think Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu is excellent but to be a "Well Rounded" fighter adding Kenpo or American Karate is a very big plus.
Reply:Judomofo has the response I can agree with the most.
There's no such thing as an ineffective martial art: There's just ineffective training methods and concepts that many styles live by, which, unfortunately, causes a lot of experienced/inexperienced people trouble in competition and street situations. These are the things that sometimes weigh down people within styles. This is not a determination of effectiveness, but moreso application. There's some styles that are easier to learn than others to learn for any number of people.
You see styles such as BJJ, San Shou, Muay Thai, and Kyokushin (Or Seidokan) karate do well in things such as MMA and the street because they usually have intense training methods, and the men/women that show their talents are sometimes as tuff as nails (Or their counterparts in other styles ^_^ ). That training is what gives them the edge. Just think: If Muay Thai had traditonal one step sparring that is well-known in some forms of Karate, how effective would it be? :P
-Kicks are very effective in the right hands, however: High kicks tend to be risky. They make for great KOs, but they are integral to all around self defense. It's either that, or you at least have to have strong legs as to not have them to successfully weakened so easily.
Tae Kwon Do, contrary to popular belief, has kicks that go to all regions. Many styles and schools, however, adopt "Point-Sparring" (Which by itself is horrible, but as a part of an overall three level sparring [Point, light contact, and full contact] is ok), or they do not teach traditional things such as knees, elbows, and leg kicks. Originally, it was very good, and most of the kicks were to the body and below, which are still to this day effective. I've taken it before, and while head kicks do help in sparring: I usually go for the body. Cracking a rib with a side kick is easier than knocking someone out with a tornado inside crescent in most people.
There was a big movement away from the cheap moves, but those are the kind of things that one needs in the street. You should combine whatever "formed" moves you have with bites, eye gouges, groin strikes, et cetera... The Tao of Jeet Kune Do has a big basis around this: The ability to be unrestrained. You have every right to let your potential out should you be in a situation where you just have to fight in order to survive.
Most people just need to find one art (Or a set of arts) that teaches fighting on all ranges (Or learn 1-2 ranges and defense against attacks from other ranges such as Wing Chun close combat, with the "Counter-grappling" element heavily expressed), spar with people from other disciplines to get a feel for people that fight differently, and learn to apply the moves that work for them, and no one else (Another part of the Tao of JKD).
Any of the arts you've listed can be effective
TKD- Ease of high kicks (Unless you have mad skills, or that's practical for you), more intense training, and a combination sparring that includes full contact is all that's needed. That, and the one learning how to apply the techniques. The legs are bigger limbs, and it may just be ones gift: Especially if their build aligns to it.
Kenpo- Usually this has a higher ratio of hand striking than leg striking, and that's perfectly fine. The sparring concept is the same here: One has to get close to the traditional ring setting, which is one of the closest settting to a street fight.
Kung Fu- The same applies, depending on style. A lot of the styles mix concepts, and some also include weight training. One has to learn application, and they must stay intense with training.
These apply with Judo, Sambo, Wrestling, and BJJ: These grappling styles have intense sparring elements, and they are important for successful use. That resistance, and compeitition is what emulates a street situation.
The styles do vary on a plane of aggression also, however. Kung Fu, TKD, and Kenpo are more defensive in nature than something such as Muay Thai, but defense is important in Muay Thai, although the offense/offensive counter is usually what wins a good match.
It's not the style: It's the training methodology, application, length in style, and training intensity that matters. Skill is skill: That is not style depedent.
Reply:Having taken TKD I can tell you it stunk in a streetfight. I just reverted back to my street fighting and won everytime.
Boxing is effective. Unless you are fighting a person who has ground skills, but that is highly unlikely.
Judo and Jiu Jitsu is obviously great self defense.
It is hard to say about Kung Fu, Akido, Hapkido etc. since they don't like to spar in the same mannder Judo and Jiu Jitsu. In fact we have yet to see them do anything on the street.
Reply:ok...first off, u do not use martials arts in street fights. and if you learned Taekwondo, you went to the wrong kind of Taekwondo school...lol... First off, Martial arts is for self defense. In Taekwondo, you should be able to learn how to defend yourself not just with kicks but also counters using your arms, fists, knees, palms, all that stuff. all Martial Arts are effective. it just depends on how you use it and how you perform the correct technique need at the correct time. Soo... yeah...
Reply:Man I do WTF Taekwondo, and I can tell you.
Headshots for the win.
I don't even know how many headshots I given to people, or if I made there nose/mouth bleed lol.
If it was a real fight most likely a good trained tkd person can knock him/her out. Or you can either fricken break their ribs/kill their breath with a back kick.
It's all the user of the art basically.
Reply:Wow...this is quite a chain of responses and counter-responses.
The art is only as good as the experience, ability, and knowledge of the practitioner. TaeKwon-Do is an extremely effective art as my own students have occassionally been unlucky enough to have to prove in real physical defense situations. I'm eqully convinced that Kenpo, Kung Fu, and boxing are equally applicable given an equally experienced, able, and knowledgable practitioner.
Your point about these arts being limited against a grappler is valid to a degree, but again it comes down entirely to the ability of each practitioner. None of the times I ever had to use defensive techniques ever ended up on the ground or grappling, and none of my TaeKwon-Do students who had to defend themselves ended up on the ground grappling with someone either. ALL systems of defense have strengths and weaknesses.
My associaiton has a freestyle sparring model which provides a similar experience to UFC/MMA without the full contact aspect. It allows all disciplines to compete together, utilizing all techniques avaialble, but uses the judges to determine advantage. We constatnly find that the more experienced player will have a significant advantage over a less experienced or skilled player - irrespective of the discipline either comes from. The inexperienced grappler often leaves themselves open to counter strikes before they get the kicker or puncher to the ground, or they leave vital areas open to attack once on the ground. Equally, the inexpereinced kicker or puncher often executes their technique too slowly or does not recover their leg or arm effectively, leaving an opening for grapplers or counter-fighters to take them down.
It's also a strange falacy to believe that TaeKwon-Do, or Kung Fu, or Karate practitioners never consider the possibility that physical defensive situations could end up in close or on the ground. I'm certainly well aware of it and my students train and prepare for it. I also know a number of fellow instructors who do the same.
So I think the premise of your question is somewhat flawed in it's broad generalization of all artists.
Ken C
9th Dan HapMoosaKi-Do
8th Dan TaeKwon-Do
7th Dan YongChul-Do
for me i belive if you fight more than two attackers you wont possibly win. this is why i think brazilian jujitsu will serve as self defense as will judo, sambo, amateur wrestling and a few other styles but they are not practiced often. more often than not its the least effective arts that are taught that you cannot you in a defensive situation.
why is this?
Are these martial arts effective at all in a street fight?
I don't believe in ineffective styles.
I believe in ineffective training methods.
Any style, technique is simply a tool in your tool belt, you have to learn of it's effectiveness for you, or ineffectiveness. By large and large Judo is considered an "effective" art by most standards. However that doesn't mean every single throw is combat effective, or even effective for a person. A great Judoka has maybe 2 or 3 throws that he can do at any angle, without fail.
A world champion boxer has maybe one or two good punches that he can hit accurately with knock out power with regularity.
The same with all fighters, they have an arsenal of a bunch of moves, but perfect a few, they have a style based on that.
But the only way you learn those things is through combat, sparring, hard resistent alive training against opponents who are attempting to do the same to you. That is where you develop what works for you and what doesn't.
I don't believe in writing a whole style off, there are proven techniques in nearly all the styles, but I will quickly write off any training approach that does not train with resistance and alive hard sparring. Until you can perform a technique on an individual repeatedly who is trying to prevent you from doing so, you don't truly have grasp of that technique.
Additionally until you have done so under adrenaline, you truly aren't effective either. I have seen guys who are dojo bad@sses, that can wipe the floor with everyone they face, but the second they get in a ring, cage, or tournament suddenly they just suck. Similarly I have seen guys do horrible in the dojo or gym, and see them just destroy guys in tournaments, cages, and rings.
I think a lot of people discount actual instincts, and think for some reason that because a person does this or this, that they some how won't have basic human instinct.
News Flash: Wrestlers, Judokas, BJJer, Samboist, all can punch as well. They can all throw fists, and do what comes natural to humans for combat. They are just more skilled once it comes to a grappling or in close portion.
I think that anything in which you can actively spar heavy and hard with, and get a chance to compete in against a stranger gives you a distinct advantage in adrenaline based situations.
The truth is the best techniques are simple, and they are in every art in some form. Every art has a punches, kicks, etc.
They may vary how they do it, but they all have it.
There are techniques from any art you can incorporate into your repetoire and make effective. But only is made effective by actually doing it at full speed, at full intensity, with regularity.
Simple fact is I HIGHLY doubt you "fight in a cage" because your ideas are flawed towards ONLY grappling. A boxer would DESTROY a bum on the street.
I am not sure where you get BJJ, Judo, and Amateur wrestling aren't practiced often. Practically every High School in the US, England, and the civilized world has a Wrestling team. Judo is EVERYWHERE. BJJ might be harder to find, but not so much. I can see how Sambo might be thought of as less practiced.
Also if you don't see how leg kicks, body kicks, liver kicks, knees, elbows, and fists won't help you in a fight, on the street. Well then you are a lost cause.
Grappling is just one range of fighting, and mind you can close the distance and get to it quickly. However that doesn't discount the need to know effective striking.
Again, this comes from actually striking, not from forms, not from bags, not from point sparring, and tippy tap sparring. But from hard sparring, and practicing those skills as close to a fully adrenalized situation as possible.
Grappling gives you the bonus of being able to train at full speed, full intensity, and having lesser chance for injury. It's VERY effective training, but there is also very effective striking.
More importantly, there is striking defense that has to be learned, if you grapple only and rarely have shots thrown at you, you have no idea how much you can actually get hurt, how an open guard is punishment, and how being turtled is one of the worst positions you can be in.
Again, I think you need to know all phases of unnarmed combat, and know them effectively, by effectively training. I don't think this is an art specific problem, I think this is a training problem. I think most arts specialize in one area, and rightly so. You should learn from those specialist, then cross train with other specialist, and become a well rounded fighter.
I don't think one art can show you everything, because there are nuances to each phase that you can only get from specializing in it. Additionally techniques that could be effective for your body style, or traits are left out.
For example:
Take Judo: There are 67 some odd official throws, hundreds of variations. In general Osoto Gari, Seionage, Uechi Mata, are some of the more used throws.
However there are literally hundreds of ways to throw these throws. An art that combines striking, throws, ground work, might show you one or two ways to throw these throws, and none of them could be the most effective for you. But also, they leave out literally hundreds of other throws aside from these that could be a better suit for you.
The only way to really know what throws work for you, and the various ways of throwing them is to go to a Judo place and work.
Everyone has their own style, their own techniques that work better for their build and their abilities. With effective alive training they can find them, they can develop timing, they can see the reactions, know openings, know how and when to use a technique and how when to NOT use a particular technique.
I believe in training methods, not specific arts. I won't write off an entire art, because it could have stuff I can use. I will write off a place that doesn't train effectively or realistically, and attempts to disguise this by saying it is too dangerous or secretive.
Well that is my take, to be effective you need to be well rounded. You don't have to be the best at any one thing, but you should be able to defend yourself in any range of combat.
If you neglect one area, then you are weak in that area, and in turn weak to defend against it.
You don't have to be the best boxer in the world, but you better know how to defend against good boxing. The same with grappling. YOu don't have to be a submission expert, but you damn sure better be competent with defending them, and the requires a high level of familiarity of them. Familiarity you get from sparring at that range against skilled opponents and recognizing the common set ups, and feeling when they are going for it.
It's not about arts, or even individuals (though athleticism and natural talent do have a say in matters) it is about effective training and developing your own style, knowing what works for you and what doesn't, and any possible thing that can be thrown at you, at least to the competency of how to defend against it.
That is just my opinion.
Reply:they ''re only effective if the combat is between two individuals ^^
Reply:No!
Martial arts are not for street fights!
Street fights are an illegal and, quite frankly, stupid activity. If you keep getting into them, sooner or later, you'll cross the wrong person. The wrong person is either a) A hardened criminal who won't think twice about using a deadly weapon. b) A mugger who wants to get you isolated so his friends can jump you and get your valuables c) A crazed drug addict or mental health patient who doesn't have an "off" switch once they go off. d) A sociopath who doesn't care how he wins, as long as he does (again, weapons)... A number of other scenarios come to mind.
Martial arts in street fights is the stuff of movies. In real life, street fighting is about violence, plain and simple - about attempting to submit and incapacitate another person. If you're lucky enough to be doing this with a person who has the same idea as you about what's acceptable and what's not in a "fair" fight, but sooner or later, you're going to get into a scuffle with someone who has no such notion. By the time you realize this, it may be too late and you may be living your last moments on earth, or about to be disabled for life.
And if you keep playing tough and street-fighting, it's not a question of IF this will happen, but WHEN. This is not high school anymore and it certainly isn't the movies. With any luck, martial arts will give you the wisdom to walk away from this kind of macho idiocy.
Now self-defence is another issue. Self-defence and fighting are not the same. Any martial art is good for self-defence. Their main benifit is confidence and awareness - two skills that have more to do with survival than any "technique". Your first concern if assaulted should not be to win - but to get out of the situation. Call in help if you can. Run if that's open to you. Staying there and mixing it up with a violent person is just asking for trouble and trouble will find you sooner or later.
No you don't.
If you're such an expert (a professional no less!), why are you asking us?
Reply:Off course these are effective in your daily life. I'm taking karate class and we are learning the most important thing: self defense. It also teaches us how to fight 1to1, 1to2, and 1to3. Once I was attacked by 2 people and I defended myself. Those techniques were very much helpful.
Reply:Martial arts is a defensive protection and should only be used for protection, but it is based on your abilities and skills. Once you acquired the experience and skills doesn't mean you can whip any one. It means you'll be able to protect yourself.
Once heard (quote)"that with great power,comes great responsibility"(unquote) Martial art is a tool, just like a gun or knife. You use it irresponsible you'll hurt yourself or someone else. You need to investigate the art you wish to master and once you started some classes you'll gain the confidence to excel.
ie..........
Martial art whether gained from jujitsu or taekwondo was intended for self defense and not for running down the other guy and kicking his *ss, to do so has made you the attacker, and subject to the laws or civil actions that occur. One should not seek marital art to improve his performance in the "ring".
Reply:When I was 3 months into training in American Karate, I learned that who wins in a fight is dependent upon the individual himself or herself. I've met people who trained regularly and are easily beaten in a contest. And I've met people with no formal martial arts training who (I feel) were very intimidating. I don't feel it's the Style of martial arts that matters, but the intensity in your training, and how badly do you want to win (in competitive tournaments, or defending yourself on the street). Definitely, try out the style (or club) that your considering joining. If they do not allow you to sit-in on classes for a week, or at least 3 days, then walk away. Important points: How the Instructor(s) relate to the student(s), how good are the facilities, what is stressed in the teaching (Forms and/or applied techniques as in Sparring), what is it you want to get from the training. I thought I just wanted to look Kool with high-jumping, high kicking movements, but found I appreciated developing confidence in myself was what I really wanted.
Reply:the problem most people have is that they don't see the difference between by the book martial arts and straight fighting.
The original martial arts were taught as an instrument of self defense. They used all the tricks in the book (the dirty ones too) to defend themselves against agression. Of course as training became organised inevitably there had to be a system of rules and restrictions to keep students from beating each other to a bloody pulp every class. Problem with many modern MA is that these rules have been so embedded that people forget to look towards realism and sometimes are so stuck to their pure style that against some one who's "been taught from another book" they are useless. Wide knowledge , experience and a sence of realism are what makes for a good and useable form of martial art.
Reply:Dude, martial arts don't fight. It's the person that fights. Just because you train in a martial art, doesn't mean that you have to fight exactly like that.
Another thing too, the NAME of the art itself is a lifeless concept and it's up to YOU to bring the concept to life.
Like Taekwondo for instance, it means way of the fist and foot. Does that mean that you have to use high flashy kicks? NO. Just because your instructor does it, doesn't mean yu have to as well. Your instructor is their as a purpose JUST TO GET YOU STARTED. He lays the basics down for you. After that, it's up to you to modify the techniques to suit you better.
So to answer your question, it's all about the techniques and strategies that YOU YOURSELF uses. This is when it becomes YOUR OWN martial art, and the techniques that you picked up from training will then become JUST techniques. Not Kenpo techniques, or BJJ techniques, etc.
That's the way how martial arts REALLY supposed to work.
Oh and another thing. You got the wrong idea about ground grappling working for multiple attackers. If you stand there and grapple with someone and then go to the ground with him, that is a dangerous and stupid mistake for you. The best thing to do is to stay on your feet and strike as long as you can, because once you're on the ground, you are either going to get cut up, busted up, or pummeled to death by your attacker and not to mention his/her friends if he has any around.
You also got the wrong idea about striking not working for one on one situations. That's bull. You are more at risk grappling with your opponent than you are with striking. I'd rather fire a rapid combination of strikes at my opponent, knowing that i'm going to hurt him for sure, rather than grapple with him, when hurting him is not always the case.
THINK.
Reply:In a street fight, is all out as everyone knows
-my friend's been in quite a lot
The best form of martial arts are Chinese Martial Arts, Tae Kwon Do is only to get the threat away from u
but chinese martial arts has many MANY forms. I'm currently learning the five ancient styles and it really works in a all out street fight. Chinese Martial arts is the most likely to success against more then 1 opponent
The styles u listed on ur question, they are just 1 form and not multiple forms. Good fighters hav more then 1 styles
I hav Tai Chi fists, Judo, and White Crane Fists
o
and my master foughts against 42 people at once haha
its possible if master multiple forms
good luck on the streets (just make sure there's witnesses)
Reply:Yeah. These are all effective in a street fight. To varying degrees. Each has strengths and weaknesses. If you're a master at any of those styles, and have enough understanding of specific attack methods of your opponent, (or plural) you can be amazingly effective. (i.e. how to avoid takedowns, or get out of an armbar, or dodge a quick jab)
Reply:Beating them to a pulp only teaches them to find easier game not change their stupid ways.So everytime you beat one of these nitwits some other poor bugger is going to pay for it or his girl freind /wife/kids.
May not be your problem but from what I have read in your post you dont seem to have much of a social concience anyway and would rather massage your vanity and call it pride.
Reply:TKD- worthless, the helpful kicks come later on in the training, require good physical strenght and constant practice.
Kenpo- really good, focuses on punches, kicks, self defense situations and judo moves. For the physical aspect you won't be able to do good kicks after you stop studying, but you still have the punches and the throws which do not require physical strenght or constant training.
Karate- good but requires you to be physical fit.
Kungfu- same as karate
Boxing- very good but requires top physical strenght
Brazilian Juijitsu - best for 1v1 does not require physical strenght. But is weak against multiple opponents.
Reply:Yes martial arts could be used in a street fight i learned how to make someone "forget how to breath" and when i was being jumped at a party i used it on one of the guys and his friends took of But i also knew how to get him breathing again. And for TKD if u don't think that one swift kick to the head isn't going to take him down then u better start another style because ur obviosly not trained enough
Reply:head kicking is not safe for fighting outside the dojo or tournaments. anyone thinking otherwise is a fool. the timing and accuracy it requires (not to mention loose clothing) goes out the window when you start to have the fine motor skill shut down when adrenaline hits home.
people who run in gangs fight all the time and protect their heads, so what good is a head kick when they charge in and cut off your only weapon? point sparring wont help train anyone for fighting outside of point sparring.
so TKD is out.
Reply:"I really don't see how kicking someone will win you a fight "
This statement doesn't make sense.
I have "personally" won 70+% of my fights with kicks to the midsection/solar plexus. "Any" experienced fighter knows this.
Is this question just to stir things up?
As for Kenpo,"every" Martial Artist on this site agrees that Kenpo is a good system.
I think Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu is excellent but to be a "Well Rounded" fighter adding Kenpo or American Karate is a very big plus.
Reply:Judomofo has the response I can agree with the most.
There's no such thing as an ineffective martial art: There's just ineffective training methods and concepts that many styles live by, which, unfortunately, causes a lot of experienced/inexperienced people trouble in competition and street situations. These are the things that sometimes weigh down people within styles. This is not a determination of effectiveness, but moreso application. There's some styles that are easier to learn than others to learn for any number of people.
You see styles such as BJJ, San Shou, Muay Thai, and Kyokushin (Or Seidokan) karate do well in things such as MMA and the street because they usually have intense training methods, and the men/women that show their talents are sometimes as tuff as nails (Or their counterparts in other styles ^_^ ). That training is what gives them the edge. Just think: If Muay Thai had traditonal one step sparring that is well-known in some forms of Karate, how effective would it be? :P
-Kicks are very effective in the right hands, however: High kicks tend to be risky. They make for great KOs, but they are integral to all around self defense. It's either that, or you at least have to have strong legs as to not have them to successfully weakened so easily.
Tae Kwon Do, contrary to popular belief, has kicks that go to all regions. Many styles and schools, however, adopt "Point-Sparring" (Which by itself is horrible, but as a part of an overall three level sparring [Point, light contact, and full contact] is ok), or they do not teach traditional things such as knees, elbows, and leg kicks. Originally, it was very good, and most of the kicks were to the body and below, which are still to this day effective. I've taken it before, and while head kicks do help in sparring: I usually go for the body. Cracking a rib with a side kick is easier than knocking someone out with a tornado inside crescent in most people.
There was a big movement away from the cheap moves, but those are the kind of things that one needs in the street. You should combine whatever "formed" moves you have with bites, eye gouges, groin strikes, et cetera... The Tao of Jeet Kune Do has a big basis around this: The ability to be unrestrained. You have every right to let your potential out should you be in a situation where you just have to fight in order to survive.
Most people just need to find one art (Or a set of arts) that teaches fighting on all ranges (Or learn 1-2 ranges and defense against attacks from other ranges such as Wing Chun close combat, with the "Counter-grappling" element heavily expressed), spar with people from other disciplines to get a feel for people that fight differently, and learn to apply the moves that work for them, and no one else (Another part of the Tao of JKD).
Any of the arts you've listed can be effective
TKD- Ease of high kicks (Unless you have mad skills, or that's practical for you), more intense training, and a combination sparring that includes full contact is all that's needed. That, and the one learning how to apply the techniques. The legs are bigger limbs, and it may just be ones gift: Especially if their build aligns to it.
Kenpo- Usually this has a higher ratio of hand striking than leg striking, and that's perfectly fine. The sparring concept is the same here: One has to get close to the traditional ring setting, which is one of the closest settting to a street fight.
Kung Fu- The same applies, depending on style. A lot of the styles mix concepts, and some also include weight training. One has to learn application, and they must stay intense with training.
These apply with Judo, Sambo, Wrestling, and BJJ: These grappling styles have intense sparring elements, and they are important for successful use. That resistance, and compeitition is what emulates a street situation.
The styles do vary on a plane of aggression also, however. Kung Fu, TKD, and Kenpo are more defensive in nature than something such as Muay Thai, but defense is important in Muay Thai, although the offense/offensive counter is usually what wins a good match.
It's not the style: It's the training methodology, application, length in style, and training intensity that matters. Skill is skill: That is not style depedent.
Reply:Having taken TKD I can tell you it stunk in a streetfight. I just reverted back to my street fighting and won everytime.
Boxing is effective. Unless you are fighting a person who has ground skills, but that is highly unlikely.
Judo and Jiu Jitsu is obviously great self defense.
It is hard to say about Kung Fu, Akido, Hapkido etc. since they don't like to spar in the same mannder Judo and Jiu Jitsu. In fact we have yet to see them do anything on the street.
Reply:ok...first off, u do not use martials arts in street fights. and if you learned Taekwondo, you went to the wrong kind of Taekwondo school...lol... First off, Martial arts is for self defense. In Taekwondo, you should be able to learn how to defend yourself not just with kicks but also counters using your arms, fists, knees, palms, all that stuff. all Martial Arts are effective. it just depends on how you use it and how you perform the correct technique need at the correct time. Soo... yeah...
Reply:Man I do WTF Taekwondo, and I can tell you.
Headshots for the win.
I don't even know how many headshots I given to people, or if I made there nose/mouth bleed lol.
If it was a real fight most likely a good trained tkd person can knock him/her out. Or you can either fricken break their ribs/kill their breath with a back kick.
It's all the user of the art basically.
Reply:Wow...this is quite a chain of responses and counter-responses.
The art is only as good as the experience, ability, and knowledge of the practitioner. TaeKwon-Do is an extremely effective art as my own students have occassionally been unlucky enough to have to prove in real physical defense situations. I'm eqully convinced that Kenpo, Kung Fu, and boxing are equally applicable given an equally experienced, able, and knowledgable practitioner.
Your point about these arts being limited against a grappler is valid to a degree, but again it comes down entirely to the ability of each practitioner. None of the times I ever had to use defensive techniques ever ended up on the ground or grappling, and none of my TaeKwon-Do students who had to defend themselves ended up on the ground grappling with someone either. ALL systems of defense have strengths and weaknesses.
My associaiton has a freestyle sparring model which provides a similar experience to UFC/MMA without the full contact aspect. It allows all disciplines to compete together, utilizing all techniques avaialble, but uses the judges to determine advantage. We constatnly find that the more experienced player will have a significant advantage over a less experienced or skilled player - irrespective of the discipline either comes from. The inexperienced grappler often leaves themselves open to counter strikes before they get the kicker or puncher to the ground, or they leave vital areas open to attack once on the ground. Equally, the inexpereinced kicker or puncher often executes their technique too slowly or does not recover their leg or arm effectively, leaving an opening for grapplers or counter-fighters to take them down.
It's also a strange falacy to believe that TaeKwon-Do, or Kung Fu, or Karate practitioners never consider the possibility that physical defensive situations could end up in close or on the ground. I'm certainly well aware of it and my students train and prepare for it. I also know a number of fellow instructors who do the same.
So I think the premise of your question is somewhat flawed in it's broad generalization of all artists.
Ken C
9th Dan HapMoosaKi-Do
8th Dan TaeKwon-Do
7th Dan YongChul-Do
Why aren't cops better trained in self defense techniques?
I have watched many police videos, and have seen several cops almost overpowered by suspects and an officer attacked and shot dead with his own gun. Granted, cops have MACE/pepper spray, batons, handguns, blackjacks, etc. But they cannot just shoot a suspect if they are unarmed. The officers have to subdue them hand to hand.
After seeing many martial arts classes in kung fu san soo, Krav Maga, Gracie style and other fighting methods, they are more than capable of using holds, arm locks, etc. to disable attackers with guns knives and physical strength of an opponent. I saw a video of the late Master Jimmy Woo who was attcked full force by guys bigger and tougher than he was, but he put them all down. Why aren't cops capable of disabling a powerful suspect with a matial art technique? Why aren't they trained better to disable an aggressive attacker? Sometimes it takes 2-4 officers to handle a rough neck. Any cops care to comment? Be careful and watch yourselves from bad elements.
Why aren't cops better trained in self defense techniques?
I work as a Corrections Officer in a maximun security prison. I have ten years of martial arts training that includes Gracie style ju jitsu. It's ignorant to assume that martial arts training FULLY prepares you for a real fight. Only real fights prepare you for real fights, because not everything happens the way you train for it, and that situation is one that officers want to avoid.
Having trained for so long, I would say I might be better prepared than some. As law enforcement officers, you often have to think about the appropriate use of force. Anyone knows that hesitation in dire straights leads to bad things, but our jobs could be on the chopping block as well as our lives. We cannot simply block the attack and break an arm with a hold. We have to JUSTIFY the force used. Lawsuits bad.
Plus, it's expensive to put an entire force through regimented tactical martial arts training. A sad but true fact that budget enters into the equation.
I, personally, have never been in or seen a demonstration where people were attacking "full force" and being defended as such. I would like to see if Tito Ortiz could defend himself against 4 armed men.
Reply:In some departments they are, now the use tazer guns. also some of the suspects are on Meth. and that's one drug that in many cases take several officers to bring a suspect down
Reply:Your Right
Reply:There are alot of bad guys that work out, alot. To expect every cop to be able to Bruce Lee every bad guy is not realistic. Add in PCP, meth etc and you can have your hands full.
Reply:It seems that once you're in, you're in. Why are so many cops so fat they couldnt get to their gun without shotting themselves. Why have cops lost all aspects of human relations? When is the last time a cop talked decently to you. They act like smartasses even if you are just asking for directions. Now all cops do not meet this criteria but more meet this criteria than I am comfortable with. Yes, martial arts would be great. Maybe they could arrest someone without beating them half to death. But who is going to make them do any of this training?
Reply:Every situation will vary from department to department, and in many cases its hard to say what an officer would, could or should have done in the heat of the moment. Many officers are trained in basic self defense, but few really go all out and get more advanced training, and many stay in shape better than others. Also another factor, is the person they might be trying to arrest, might be under the infulence of something and have to be overpowered. And many offenders who don't have a problem killing a cop, is someone with nothing to lose, but freedom. Also the fact that many offenders might be bigger than the officers, and this does play a big part. Yes, I am all for officers getting the best training possible in the areas of self defense and also having the best tools to assist them in their daily duties. This topic can go on and on, but I strongly feel that every officer does a thankless job, and they need all the support and funding they can get, to better, "Protect and Serve".
Reply:Most modern law enforcement agencies do train in hand to hand combat. In fact, many use the same guidelines our military use. But a glaring difference in your examples as related to real police work is that martial artists are just that, martial artists. (Not all, but most) And as such, they train daily. Law enforcement officers spend approximately 20% of the off duty time attending court, many have families which require their quality time and may are otherwise involved doing overtime work or who knows what? They live their lives much as anyone else does, they do a little personal work in ther spare time and they have some fun.
One of the best arguments in favor of the use of the Taser. A very efficient non-lethal method to subdue a suspect.
Reply:Being a firefighter, I've responded to some of these incidents.
Drug users are very, very, very, strong. Meth and PCP especially. Some of our police officers are not in shape. I even watched one police officer at the firing range blast a round through his holster, trying to draw it. (very funny)
Reply:TO BE HONEST, THE PUBLIC AND GOVERNMENT. THEY ISSUE US A BATON AND WHEN JUSTIFIED, CAN STRIKE A PERSON WITH IT. TAKE THE SAME SCENERIO, BUT SAY WE CANT GET TO OUR BATON AND HIT THEM WITH A FLASH LIGHT..ITS CONSIDERED EXCESSIVE FORCE. THE PUBLIC AND SUPREME COURT STATES THAT AN BATON IS MADE TO STRIKE AND A FLASHLIGHT IS NOT. ITS STUPID.
THEY ALSO PREACH LIABILITY ALMOST IN EVERY STATE. MOST STATES BAN OFFICERS FROM USING A CHOKE HOLD (MINUS CHOKING THE PERSON). MOST STATES ONLY WANT US USING PRESSURE POINTS WHICH DONT WORK ON ALOT OF PEOPLE OR PEOPLE ON SOME DRUGS. SOCIETY MAKES IT SO HARD BECAUSE EVERYTIME, A SUSPECT GETS HURT, ITS HOLLERED THAT THE POLICE ABUSED THEM.
NO GRANTED OVER THE YEARS THERE HAVE BEEN ALOT OF ABUSIVE COPS AND STILL ARE SOME TODAY. BUT INSTEAD OF JUST PUNISHING THE ABUSIVE ONES (IF THEY DO THAT), THEY PUNISH EVERY COP BY PLACING MORE STIPULATIONS ON US. I NEVER HEAR THE PUBLIC CRY OUT TO THE SUPREME COURT OR MEDIA WHEN AN OFFICER IS SERIOUSLY HURT OR KILL...SO WHY IS IT DONE THE OTHER WAY AROUND. THATS LIFE AND I DEAL WITH AND AM STILL ABLE TO DO MY JOB.
I HAVE BEEN IN MANY SITUATIONS WHERE I HAVE HURT (EXTENSIVELY AT TIMES) AND I COULD HAVE GOTTEN OUT OF IT IF I RESORTED TO STREET FIGHTING TECHNIQUES, BUT THE COURTS AND SOCIETY LOOKS AT IT AS STREET VIOLENCE AND POLICE BRUTALITY. WHEN IT COMES DOWN TO IT THOUGH, ILL DUE WHAT I GOT TO DO...HOPEFULLY.
THIS IS WHY SO MANY COPS DONT STAY IN THIS LINE OF WORK..NO COMMUNITY SUPPORT MAJORITY OF THE TIME. THEY EITHER LEAVE THE PROFESSION, COMMITT SUICIDE (SAD, BUT TRUE), OR ARE FIRED BECAUSE OF PUBLIC OUTRAGE.
Reply:they r prepared to fight...but they cant like beat ur *** with punches till ur bleading....they have a limit
Reply:Because it takes 10 plus years to be a martial arts master, and the police have to train a officer in less than 6 months to go out onto the streets.
Next they can not hit a suspect the ways martial arts people do, that would be excessive force and they would be sued.
And yes, to do an arrest, without using excessive force as viewed by the courts, it will take 3 or 4 officers.
And some poeple who are mental health, or on certain drugs, you can hit them with your ASP and they don't even notice it.
We had 6 officers trying to take down 1 man, they had to break his arm and a leg with ASPs before he fell to the ground, and even then he keep fighting.
Also with the large amounts of law suits, most officers hesitate, they don't strike first, so after the other person makes his first move, they are at the advantage.
I merely grabbed a suspect and pushed him against his car to cuff him, and I had a excessive force case filed against me.
Cops do not "fight" they are only to detain and arrest.
Reply:I don't think Master Jimmy Woo became a master studying for an hour a day, five days a week, for 6 months. It takes years of training to attain that level of skill.
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After seeing many martial arts classes in kung fu san soo, Krav Maga, Gracie style and other fighting methods, they are more than capable of using holds, arm locks, etc. to disable attackers with guns knives and physical strength of an opponent. I saw a video of the late Master Jimmy Woo who was attcked full force by guys bigger and tougher than he was, but he put them all down. Why aren't cops capable of disabling a powerful suspect with a matial art technique? Why aren't they trained better to disable an aggressive attacker? Sometimes it takes 2-4 officers to handle a rough neck. Any cops care to comment? Be careful and watch yourselves from bad elements.
Why aren't cops better trained in self defense techniques?
I work as a Corrections Officer in a maximun security prison. I have ten years of martial arts training that includes Gracie style ju jitsu. It's ignorant to assume that martial arts training FULLY prepares you for a real fight. Only real fights prepare you for real fights, because not everything happens the way you train for it, and that situation is one that officers want to avoid.
Having trained for so long, I would say I might be better prepared than some. As law enforcement officers, you often have to think about the appropriate use of force. Anyone knows that hesitation in dire straights leads to bad things, but our jobs could be on the chopping block as well as our lives. We cannot simply block the attack and break an arm with a hold. We have to JUSTIFY the force used. Lawsuits bad.
Plus, it's expensive to put an entire force through regimented tactical martial arts training. A sad but true fact that budget enters into the equation.
I, personally, have never been in or seen a demonstration where people were attacking "full force" and being defended as such. I would like to see if Tito Ortiz could defend himself against 4 armed men.
Reply:In some departments they are, now the use tazer guns. also some of the suspects are on Meth. and that's one drug that in many cases take several officers to bring a suspect down
Reply:Your Right
Reply:There are alot of bad guys that work out, alot. To expect every cop to be able to Bruce Lee every bad guy is not realistic. Add in PCP, meth etc and you can have your hands full.
Reply:It seems that once you're in, you're in. Why are so many cops so fat they couldnt get to their gun without shotting themselves. Why have cops lost all aspects of human relations? When is the last time a cop talked decently to you. They act like smartasses even if you are just asking for directions. Now all cops do not meet this criteria but more meet this criteria than I am comfortable with. Yes, martial arts would be great. Maybe they could arrest someone without beating them half to death. But who is going to make them do any of this training?
Reply:Every situation will vary from department to department, and in many cases its hard to say what an officer would, could or should have done in the heat of the moment. Many officers are trained in basic self defense, but few really go all out and get more advanced training, and many stay in shape better than others. Also another factor, is the person they might be trying to arrest, might be under the infulence of something and have to be overpowered. And many offenders who don't have a problem killing a cop, is someone with nothing to lose, but freedom. Also the fact that many offenders might be bigger than the officers, and this does play a big part. Yes, I am all for officers getting the best training possible in the areas of self defense and also having the best tools to assist them in their daily duties. This topic can go on and on, but I strongly feel that every officer does a thankless job, and they need all the support and funding they can get, to better, "Protect and Serve".
Reply:Most modern law enforcement agencies do train in hand to hand combat. In fact, many use the same guidelines our military use. But a glaring difference in your examples as related to real police work is that martial artists are just that, martial artists. (Not all, but most) And as such, they train daily. Law enforcement officers spend approximately 20% of the off duty time attending court, many have families which require their quality time and may are otherwise involved doing overtime work or who knows what? They live their lives much as anyone else does, they do a little personal work in ther spare time and they have some fun.
One of the best arguments in favor of the use of the Taser. A very efficient non-lethal method to subdue a suspect.
Reply:Being a firefighter, I've responded to some of these incidents.
Drug users are very, very, very, strong. Meth and PCP especially. Some of our police officers are not in shape. I even watched one police officer at the firing range blast a round through his holster, trying to draw it. (very funny)
Reply:TO BE HONEST, THE PUBLIC AND GOVERNMENT. THEY ISSUE US A BATON AND WHEN JUSTIFIED, CAN STRIKE A PERSON WITH IT. TAKE THE SAME SCENERIO, BUT SAY WE CANT GET TO OUR BATON AND HIT THEM WITH A FLASH LIGHT..ITS CONSIDERED EXCESSIVE FORCE. THE PUBLIC AND SUPREME COURT STATES THAT AN BATON IS MADE TO STRIKE AND A FLASHLIGHT IS NOT. ITS STUPID.
THEY ALSO PREACH LIABILITY ALMOST IN EVERY STATE. MOST STATES BAN OFFICERS FROM USING A CHOKE HOLD (MINUS CHOKING THE PERSON). MOST STATES ONLY WANT US USING PRESSURE POINTS WHICH DONT WORK ON ALOT OF PEOPLE OR PEOPLE ON SOME DRUGS. SOCIETY MAKES IT SO HARD BECAUSE EVERYTIME, A SUSPECT GETS HURT, ITS HOLLERED THAT THE POLICE ABUSED THEM.
NO GRANTED OVER THE YEARS THERE HAVE BEEN ALOT OF ABUSIVE COPS AND STILL ARE SOME TODAY. BUT INSTEAD OF JUST PUNISHING THE ABUSIVE ONES (IF THEY DO THAT), THEY PUNISH EVERY COP BY PLACING MORE STIPULATIONS ON US. I NEVER HEAR THE PUBLIC CRY OUT TO THE SUPREME COURT OR MEDIA WHEN AN OFFICER IS SERIOUSLY HURT OR KILL...SO WHY IS IT DONE THE OTHER WAY AROUND. THATS LIFE AND I DEAL WITH AND AM STILL ABLE TO DO MY JOB.
I HAVE BEEN IN MANY SITUATIONS WHERE I HAVE HURT (EXTENSIVELY AT TIMES) AND I COULD HAVE GOTTEN OUT OF IT IF I RESORTED TO STREET FIGHTING TECHNIQUES, BUT THE COURTS AND SOCIETY LOOKS AT IT AS STREET VIOLENCE AND POLICE BRUTALITY. WHEN IT COMES DOWN TO IT THOUGH, ILL DUE WHAT I GOT TO DO...HOPEFULLY.
THIS IS WHY SO MANY COPS DONT STAY IN THIS LINE OF WORK..NO COMMUNITY SUPPORT MAJORITY OF THE TIME. THEY EITHER LEAVE THE PROFESSION, COMMITT SUICIDE (SAD, BUT TRUE), OR ARE FIRED BECAUSE OF PUBLIC OUTRAGE.
Reply:they r prepared to fight...but they cant like beat ur *** with punches till ur bleading....they have a limit
Reply:Because it takes 10 plus years to be a martial arts master, and the police have to train a officer in less than 6 months to go out onto the streets.
Next they can not hit a suspect the ways martial arts people do, that would be excessive force and they would be sued.
And yes, to do an arrest, without using excessive force as viewed by the courts, it will take 3 or 4 officers.
And some poeple who are mental health, or on certain drugs, you can hit them with your ASP and they don't even notice it.
We had 6 officers trying to take down 1 man, they had to break his arm and a leg with ASPs before he fell to the ground, and even then he keep fighting.
Also with the large amounts of law suits, most officers hesitate, they don't strike first, so after the other person makes his first move, they are at the advantage.
I merely grabbed a suspect and pushed him against his car to cuff him, and I had a excessive force case filed against me.
Cops do not "fight" they are only to detain and arrest.
Reply:I don't think Master Jimmy Woo became a master studying for an hour a day, five days a week, for 6 months. It takes years of training to attain that level of skill.
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Wut type of fiting style is the most of effective and which one should i learn?
and i dont want to take the fake kung fu karate and taikwon do **** i want real fighting
Wut type of fiting style is the most of effective and which one should i learn?
Not sure what you mean by "real fighting." The martial arts you mention as well as others can teach you a lot about technique as well as very useful moves and combinations all while conditioning your body and mind. There are also hapkido or aikido for grappling and joint locks. So, there is nothing "fake" about any of those. An individual who is proficient in any of those arts would be a very good fighter. You could also take the route of someone like Bruce Lee who found those arts limiting and developed his own style by transforming what he learned into something he found more useful. In any event, there is no "most effective" style of fighting in my opinion. It depends on the individual's skill in whatever style he knows.
Reply:I have recently started Okinawan Shorin-Ryu Sieto Karate. I know it's a long name but it's basically just Okinawan street fighting. I think it is the best style if you want real life fighting and defense techniques. It was developed by the people of Okinawa to defend themselves against the invading Japanese. and it has been improved for over 300 years! It includes the ten self defense moves that the navy seals incorporate into their training as well as training that teaches you to use anything as a weapon. As far as I can tell it is the most realistic and effective fighting style that exists. If you have any other questions my email is bfros454@yahoo.com.
Reply:Go to the hardware store and get PVC piping and foam pipe insulation. Make a few swords. Read some history about medieval warfare (movies always get this wrong). Get a friend who is interested in the same stuff, go out on the lawn and if you're not good enough you'll get thwacked in the head with a piece of foam covered PVC. "Practice makes perfect", after about a year you'll be able to kick anynone's butt (as long as he doesn't have a gun).
Have fun.
Reply:Mixing martial arts is the best way to defend yourself. Learn Muay Thai Kickboxing for close and ranged strikes...and Jujitsu for grappling and ground fighthing. Learn those two well, and you'll have nothing to worry about.
Reply:brazilian jiu jitsu/judo
Wut type of fiting style is the most of effective and which one should i learn?
Not sure what you mean by "real fighting." The martial arts you mention as well as others can teach you a lot about technique as well as very useful moves and combinations all while conditioning your body and mind. There are also hapkido or aikido for grappling and joint locks. So, there is nothing "fake" about any of those. An individual who is proficient in any of those arts would be a very good fighter. You could also take the route of someone like Bruce Lee who found those arts limiting and developed his own style by transforming what he learned into something he found more useful. In any event, there is no "most effective" style of fighting in my opinion. It depends on the individual's skill in whatever style he knows.
Reply:I have recently started Okinawan Shorin-Ryu Sieto Karate. I know it's a long name but it's basically just Okinawan street fighting. I think it is the best style if you want real life fighting and defense techniques. It was developed by the people of Okinawa to defend themselves against the invading Japanese. and it has been improved for over 300 years! It includes the ten self defense moves that the navy seals incorporate into their training as well as training that teaches you to use anything as a weapon. As far as I can tell it is the most realistic and effective fighting style that exists. If you have any other questions my email is bfros454@yahoo.com.
Reply:Go to the hardware store and get PVC piping and foam pipe insulation. Make a few swords. Read some history about medieval warfare (movies always get this wrong). Get a friend who is interested in the same stuff, go out on the lawn and if you're not good enough you'll get thwacked in the head with a piece of foam covered PVC. "Practice makes perfect", after about a year you'll be able to kick anynone's butt (as long as he doesn't have a gun).
Have fun.
Reply:Mixing martial arts is the best way to defend yourself. Learn Muay Thai Kickboxing for close and ranged strikes...and Jujitsu for grappling and ground fighthing. Learn those two well, and you'll have nothing to worry about.
Reply:brazilian jiu jitsu/judo
ALL BETS IN -THE WINNER GETS 10 points?
2 guys @ my school how are fighting , 1 is a close Friend and i want no his chances. AFTER THE FIGHT I WILL CHOOSE
THE YAHOO WINNER IF HE/SHE PREDICTS THE FIGHT eg- person A wins by k.o. because of punches or knees,i.e in detail
PERSON A
5''5
Very stong, can bench and squat more than in school.
Has lost to taller strickers but also beaten boxer.
He has a wrestling style im not sure what type . looks like judo or ju-jitsu and know a little boxing
PERSON B
5''7
Fast,knows how to fight ,he is known for he's karate or kung- fu.
he's been doing boxing for about 10 months
he is exlenent with his stricking
weight is 50-70 he' has alot of fight exp.
i'll try to post there post fight on you tube
ALL BETS IN -THE WINNER GETS 10 points?
I am going to take Person B will win this fight by knocking Person A out with a punch to the face
Reply:i reckon person B. he sounds harder.
Reply:its easy person A will win becoz he has a different types of fighting so person B can't sure where he will hit him but person A can make strategies as u said that person B fighting style is kung-fu or karate.
Reply:I am going for A - he's got a lower point of gravity (smaller) will be harder to knock down.
Also love the underdog
Reply:I am betting....that you need to get a life!
Reply:Person B will win by knocking Person A on his butt with a right cross
Reply:I'll go with B.
Reply:The guy with the darker hair will win.
Reply:person A takes the cake by a brutal ground and pound.
Reply:I'm betting this is a gigantic load of BS.
Reply:you lack enough sufficeint, and critical, information on person A for me to determine who would really win. We don't even know how much fight experience that A has.
If A is a wrestler, then B will win if he stays out of grab reach. However, if B gets too close or gets leg caught, B will trip him down into a grappling pin. The fight can only be ended in close quarters, so I say A wins via pin and maybe some punches to the pinned guy.
Reply:person B i thnking
Reply:Person B
Reply:The one who avoids the fight wins.
Reply:dee dee dee!
Reply:person 2 with an uppercut
THE YAHOO WINNER IF HE/SHE PREDICTS THE FIGHT eg- person A wins by k.o. because of punches or knees,i.e in detail
PERSON A
5''5
Very stong, can bench and squat more than in school.
Has lost to taller strickers but also beaten boxer.
He has a wrestling style im not sure what type . looks like judo or ju-jitsu and know a little boxing
PERSON B
5''7
Fast,knows how to fight ,he is known for he's karate or kung- fu.
he's been doing boxing for about 10 months
he is exlenent with his stricking
weight is 50-70 he' has alot of fight exp.
i'll try to post there post fight on you tube
ALL BETS IN -THE WINNER GETS 10 points?
I am going to take Person B will win this fight by knocking Person A out with a punch to the face
Reply:i reckon person B. he sounds harder.
Reply:its easy person A will win becoz he has a different types of fighting so person B can't sure where he will hit him but person A can make strategies as u said that person B fighting style is kung-fu or karate.
Reply:I am going for A - he's got a lower point of gravity (smaller) will be harder to knock down.
Also love the underdog
Reply:I am betting....that you need to get a life!
Reply:Person B will win by knocking Person A on his butt with a right cross
Reply:I'll go with B.
Reply:The guy with the darker hair will win.
Reply:person A takes the cake by a brutal ground and pound.
Reply:I'm betting this is a gigantic load of BS.
Reply:you lack enough sufficeint, and critical, information on person A for me to determine who would really win. We don't even know how much fight experience that A has.
If A is a wrestler, then B will win if he stays out of grab reach. However, if B gets too close or gets leg caught, B will trip him down into a grappling pin. The fight can only be ended in close quarters, so I say A wins via pin and maybe some punches to the pinned guy.
Reply:person B i thnking
Reply:Person B
Reply:The one who avoids the fight wins.
Reply:dee dee dee!
Reply:person 2 with an uppercut
Thursday, November 12, 2009
What is the most talked about UFC fight.thats gruesome and bloody wuld jus lve ur mouth open after da fight..?
i wanted to watch the most gruesom bloody and talked about UFC fight .. cuz one of the most anticapated fight for me was matt hugges and that kung fu guy jus dissapointed me..
What is the most talked about UFC fight.thats gruesome and bloody wuld jus lve ur mouth open after da fight..?
I really liked the first Forrest Griffen and Stephan Bonnar fight it made me a true fan of MMA. Highly recommend it to people that wants to see what UFC and/or MMA is all about.
flowers funeral
What is the most talked about UFC fight.thats gruesome and bloody wuld jus lve ur mouth open after da fight..?
I really liked the first Forrest Griffen and Stephan Bonnar fight it made me a true fan of MMA. Highly recommend it to people that wants to see what UFC and/or MMA is all about.
flowers funeral
The gracie family?
How come everytime there is Grace fighting someone who apparently knows some sort of kung fu, or striking technique, the striker always throws a really poor kick toward the knee of gracie and it's gonna get caught obviously and he'll go down, and then just be dominated.
They try to play it out like all martial arts that aren't bjj are going to use a lame *** poorly executed kick that wouldn't matter if it hit you or not. just look it up on youtube like gracie vs kung fu, or gracie vs some other karate, it's all lame lame kicks, and they get Tackled basically because of it. nobody punches!? or uses any sort of sprawling or avoidance? it seems really fake Like aikido demonstrations.
The gracie family?
You know why the kicks are lame on the video you watch?
It is because they know the reputation is they are going to get taken down. So they are very careful but in the end it does not matter because if you want to close the distance and get the take down against a stand up fighter you will. If you want to kick and I want to close there is nothing you can do except hope that that big kick takes me out the first time. If not you are on your back and I will win.
Your top wrestler at your local high school could most likely take down your stand up only fighter and pound him into submission most of time.
If all you have is your striking, with a good grappler coming after you what are the chances you can knock him out before he takes you down. Answer NOT GOOD.
Reply:They do punch, only when the gracie is already close, see the basics behind punching is that you need your weight going forward, and it looks like the kung fu guys were doing their best to avoid going forward because they were scared to get taken down, so instead they used kicks and started punching when gracie moves in
Good idea but the gracies are tough and could probably take a few kicks or punches so even though some punches probably landed they were still able to do a take down and once they were down it was gg
i dont know how you see these videos as Aikido demos, they look very real too me, It looked like the kung fu guy was trying to avoid, i mean he got pushed all the way back to the wall, but if someone is determained to take you down and you have no grapling exp whatsoever, trust me you will go down, especially if you are fighting the guys who invented the stuff!
I think the whole point of the video is if you dont have any grapling exp then you wont know what to do, here the guys knew that their opponent is a grapler but still had trouble, lesson = learn grapling!
Reply:I think a lot of Gracie matches are rigged. Same with a lot of muay thai fights. If you watch either of these styles fight anything else they always dominate and it's always because of stupid moves by the other stylist. If you watch more than a handful of these types of "matches" you're sitting there thinking something smells fishy.
Reply:I think a lot of it is because of the legend Royce Gracie had built up over such a short time. Like Mike Tyson in the late 80s. Nobody thought to sit back and jab him and tie him up every time he came up for an uppercut and make him go into late rounds until after about 5 years of his competing. Once someone, Buster Douglass, figured out the "key" to Tyson, everyone had a good chance of beating him. Just don't get into a tough guy, punch it out, testosterone laced, duel with Iron Mike, and you can win.
With Gracie Jiu Jitsu, nobody had seen this kind of fighting for years. tournement Karate was king, and it was ruled by easily grabbed, non snapping side kicks. Shootboxers did much better against Gracie, but all things considered, Gracie was in much better fighting shape than everyone he went up against. Some of the guys were in their late 30s and 40s, running dojos that were loosing students, and tried to do what they could with their limited ability, and their lack of understanding of the rules of the MMA game. They came in with an assumption of modern rules and etiquette, and so they lost. Once people realized the violence of the Gracie game, they started beating him. At least as much as he was beating them. Gracie was still an excellent physical specimen and represented his martial art well.
Reply:Because most fighters facing the Gracies are trying to keep a distance pleasing to them, and the Gracies are trying to close that gap. Kick Boxing will naturally stand, and BJJ will try to close the gap and take you down, how the styles differ.
Thai clinches have done very well at forcing BJJ to stand and take a beating.
Reply:Type in Sakuraba and watch him dismantle every Gracie he fights. Rickson was basically afraid to fight him cause he didn't want to wreck his perfect record. Saku isn't even that good a striker, he just doesn't show the BJJ as much respect as others do.
Reply:Maybe the gracies are actually just that good? I mean. is it the gracies fault that that kung fu guy threw a lame kick? No. Should the kung fu guy have done better? Yes. Its too bad because those videos on you tube end up being the end all word on which martial art is better. I cant find any video on youtube that shows a gracie losing a fight. Its either pure skill or a very good marketing technique.
Reply:The Royce vs. Kung Fu guy you see on the videos was Jason Delucia. It was taken from the "Gracies in Action" video.
This was about 7 months prior to the first UFC, Jason Delucia had heard about the Gracie challenge and went down to Brasil to fight him.
He got worked easily, primarily because he was a Kung Fu guy who had never heard of grappling.
I don't think it had to do with any kind of known reputation as to these people's kicks.
Keep in mind aside from a few styles, Kung Fu's kicks are pretty poor in general. No one who is of any caliber of talent will throw a high kick right off. (Those kind of things have to be set up). So naturally when a person is beyond punching range you are going to start with a low kick.
However keep in mind that in the time frame that most of the Gracie videos were done, they were going against traditional stylists with no grappling background.
Avoidance isn't easy, Sprawling takes some sort of background and it wasn't in 90 percent of "striking" arts.
Even really good kickboxers were getting worked by grapplers. Patrick Smith, Orlando Weit, etc.
Sakuraba has what you can consider Gracie Kryptonite: Good wrestling.
A good wrestler or Judoka would give fits to most BJJ artists simply because of an ability to control the takedown, and thus control position.
Kimo Leopoldo gave Royce a hard time until he slipped up and got caught.
It's simple, at the time Gracies had a very effective style because they practiced it in Vale Tudo matches constantly and refined it. They then fought people who had never truly been in any kind of match such as that and beat them.
Some arts have now evolved because of that and work some sort of grappling into their style (wisely so) others have tried to ignore those lessons and stick to their own opinions.
"Well if it was a street fight I would have had him" type of mentality instead of correcting what they were doing wrong.
I can promise you if you have never been in a No Hold Barred competetion against another skilled individual. Your first couple of kicks are going to be timid. (There is a feeling out process in most all fights) the problem was, those initial feeling out kicks didn't get far because Gracies were good at closing the gap and getting the takedown.
It's hard to throw a full bore kick straight out the gate with another fighter. You set yourself up to be countered or taken off balance if you miss. That is why there is a jab in boxing, and low kicks in Martial Arts (they aren't full committal type of moves, you are able to feel out your range with them)
I think the Gracies were the real deal back in the day, and are still great fighters. I think that they had a very effective style that caught people off guard who had never fought that way.
Now people are aware of it, and train to be able to fight in that realm, and I think that is a good thing.
It doesn't take away from their legitimacy. They showed the world that a pure grappler can easily beat a pure striker, and changed how a lot of people viewed unarmed combat.
Reply:If they are so lame, why don't you just challenge one of the Gracies? They have been known to accept challenges from idiots.
As for the other posters: Comparing the Gracies to Mike Tyson is just plain silly, especially claiming that no one ever challenged Tyson until Buster Douglas. Douglas was probably one of the lamest fights Tyson ever accepted, which is why he chased the Japanese girls more than he saw the gym in Tokyo.
There is nothing rigged. When people are good, they make it look easy and the challenger looks ineffective. Mike Tyson made everyone look bad.
If Mike Tyson was 24 again, he would go through all of the heavyweights yet again with little resistance. This is unlike the Gracies, because in order for the MMA guys to compete in the UFC, they all learned the Gracie Style of JJ.
Finally, Rickson afraid to tarnish his record? Uhm, the guy was in his forties, when the wrestler fought the other Gracies. Anyone who disses Rickson, the greatest of the MMA types, is definitely a Gracie hater and can be discredited in any future discussions.
They try to play it out like all martial arts that aren't bjj are going to use a lame *** poorly executed kick that wouldn't matter if it hit you or not. just look it up on youtube like gracie vs kung fu, or gracie vs some other karate, it's all lame lame kicks, and they get Tackled basically because of it. nobody punches!? or uses any sort of sprawling or avoidance? it seems really fake Like aikido demonstrations.
The gracie family?
You know why the kicks are lame on the video you watch?
It is because they know the reputation is they are going to get taken down. So they are very careful but in the end it does not matter because if you want to close the distance and get the take down against a stand up fighter you will. If you want to kick and I want to close there is nothing you can do except hope that that big kick takes me out the first time. If not you are on your back and I will win.
Your top wrestler at your local high school could most likely take down your stand up only fighter and pound him into submission most of time.
If all you have is your striking, with a good grappler coming after you what are the chances you can knock him out before he takes you down. Answer NOT GOOD.
Reply:They do punch, only when the gracie is already close, see the basics behind punching is that you need your weight going forward, and it looks like the kung fu guys were doing their best to avoid going forward because they were scared to get taken down, so instead they used kicks and started punching when gracie moves in
Good idea but the gracies are tough and could probably take a few kicks or punches so even though some punches probably landed they were still able to do a take down and once they were down it was gg
i dont know how you see these videos as Aikido demos, they look very real too me, It looked like the kung fu guy was trying to avoid, i mean he got pushed all the way back to the wall, but if someone is determained to take you down and you have no grapling exp whatsoever, trust me you will go down, especially if you are fighting the guys who invented the stuff!
I think the whole point of the video is if you dont have any grapling exp then you wont know what to do, here the guys knew that their opponent is a grapler but still had trouble, lesson = learn grapling!
Reply:I think a lot of Gracie matches are rigged. Same with a lot of muay thai fights. If you watch either of these styles fight anything else they always dominate and it's always because of stupid moves by the other stylist. If you watch more than a handful of these types of "matches" you're sitting there thinking something smells fishy.
Reply:I think a lot of it is because of the legend Royce Gracie had built up over such a short time. Like Mike Tyson in the late 80s. Nobody thought to sit back and jab him and tie him up every time he came up for an uppercut and make him go into late rounds until after about 5 years of his competing. Once someone, Buster Douglass, figured out the "key" to Tyson, everyone had a good chance of beating him. Just don't get into a tough guy, punch it out, testosterone laced, duel with Iron Mike, and you can win.
With Gracie Jiu Jitsu, nobody had seen this kind of fighting for years. tournement Karate was king, and it was ruled by easily grabbed, non snapping side kicks. Shootboxers did much better against Gracie, but all things considered, Gracie was in much better fighting shape than everyone he went up against. Some of the guys were in their late 30s and 40s, running dojos that were loosing students, and tried to do what they could with their limited ability, and their lack of understanding of the rules of the MMA game. They came in with an assumption of modern rules and etiquette, and so they lost. Once people realized the violence of the Gracie game, they started beating him. At least as much as he was beating them. Gracie was still an excellent physical specimen and represented his martial art well.
Reply:Because most fighters facing the Gracies are trying to keep a distance pleasing to them, and the Gracies are trying to close that gap. Kick Boxing will naturally stand, and BJJ will try to close the gap and take you down, how the styles differ.
Thai clinches have done very well at forcing BJJ to stand and take a beating.
Reply:Type in Sakuraba and watch him dismantle every Gracie he fights. Rickson was basically afraid to fight him cause he didn't want to wreck his perfect record. Saku isn't even that good a striker, he just doesn't show the BJJ as much respect as others do.
Reply:Maybe the gracies are actually just that good? I mean. is it the gracies fault that that kung fu guy threw a lame kick? No. Should the kung fu guy have done better? Yes. Its too bad because those videos on you tube end up being the end all word on which martial art is better. I cant find any video on youtube that shows a gracie losing a fight. Its either pure skill or a very good marketing technique.
Reply:The Royce vs. Kung Fu guy you see on the videos was Jason Delucia. It was taken from the "Gracies in Action" video.
This was about 7 months prior to the first UFC, Jason Delucia had heard about the Gracie challenge and went down to Brasil to fight him.
He got worked easily, primarily because he was a Kung Fu guy who had never heard of grappling.
I don't think it had to do with any kind of known reputation as to these people's kicks.
Keep in mind aside from a few styles, Kung Fu's kicks are pretty poor in general. No one who is of any caliber of talent will throw a high kick right off. (Those kind of things have to be set up). So naturally when a person is beyond punching range you are going to start with a low kick.
However keep in mind that in the time frame that most of the Gracie videos were done, they were going against traditional stylists with no grappling background.
Avoidance isn't easy, Sprawling takes some sort of background and it wasn't in 90 percent of "striking" arts.
Even really good kickboxers were getting worked by grapplers. Patrick Smith, Orlando Weit, etc.
Sakuraba has what you can consider Gracie Kryptonite: Good wrestling.
A good wrestler or Judoka would give fits to most BJJ artists simply because of an ability to control the takedown, and thus control position.
Kimo Leopoldo gave Royce a hard time until he slipped up and got caught.
It's simple, at the time Gracies had a very effective style because they practiced it in Vale Tudo matches constantly and refined it. They then fought people who had never truly been in any kind of match such as that and beat them.
Some arts have now evolved because of that and work some sort of grappling into their style (wisely so) others have tried to ignore those lessons and stick to their own opinions.
"Well if it was a street fight I would have had him" type of mentality instead of correcting what they were doing wrong.
I can promise you if you have never been in a No Hold Barred competetion against another skilled individual. Your first couple of kicks are going to be timid. (There is a feeling out process in most all fights) the problem was, those initial feeling out kicks didn't get far because Gracies were good at closing the gap and getting the takedown.
It's hard to throw a full bore kick straight out the gate with another fighter. You set yourself up to be countered or taken off balance if you miss. That is why there is a jab in boxing, and low kicks in Martial Arts (they aren't full committal type of moves, you are able to feel out your range with them)
I think the Gracies were the real deal back in the day, and are still great fighters. I think that they had a very effective style that caught people off guard who had never fought that way.
Now people are aware of it, and train to be able to fight in that realm, and I think that is a good thing.
It doesn't take away from their legitimacy. They showed the world that a pure grappler can easily beat a pure striker, and changed how a lot of people viewed unarmed combat.
Reply:If they are so lame, why don't you just challenge one of the Gracies? They have been known to accept challenges from idiots.
As for the other posters: Comparing the Gracies to Mike Tyson is just plain silly, especially claiming that no one ever challenged Tyson until Buster Douglas. Douglas was probably one of the lamest fights Tyson ever accepted, which is why he chased the Japanese girls more than he saw the gym in Tokyo.
There is nothing rigged. When people are good, they make it look easy and the challenger looks ineffective. Mike Tyson made everyone look bad.
If Mike Tyson was 24 again, he would go through all of the heavyweights yet again with little resistance. This is unlike the Gracies, because in order for the MMA guys to compete in the UFC, they all learned the Gracie Style of JJ.
Finally, Rickson afraid to tarnish his record? Uhm, the guy was in his forties, when the wrestler fought the other Gracies. Anyone who disses Rickson, the greatest of the MMA types, is definitely a Gracie hater and can be discredited in any future discussions.
Who would win in a fair fight? The Dalai Lama or Ghandi?
Given that the Dalai Lama is accomplished in Kung Fu and Ghandi well versed in the brutal art of street fighting? (The winner is the first one to be knocked unconscious)
Who would win in a fair fight? The Dalai Lama or Ghandi?
well they would NEVER resolve to physical volence so...they would have to have a rap showdown,a dance contest, drag race ,or something?????
Reply:One hand slapping.
Reply:Dalai Lama! He weighs more and he's taller.
Reply:Dalai Lama, he is wiser and can distract Ghandi.
Wait, Ghandi is dead.!
Reply:Chuck Norris
Reply:Ther are or were both quite frail, I think it would be a boring fight
Reply:Neither. They would not get into it in the first place.
Reply:Since neither would fight because it is against their beliefs, the first on to drop dead loses. Ghandi is a hunger striking pro, so the Dalai Lama would lose.
Reply:They wouldn't fight.
Reply:Adi Da knows "The Dualing Crane Comes Down"
Reply:They would never fight. That's like asking Mother Teresa and the Virgin Mary to duke it out! Whoa, they're both dead!
We should put Tony Blair and wimpy GWB in the ring and make them duke it out. More like it .
Reply:The Dalia Lama would learn the futility of violence by striking repeatedly the Indian man of peace, Gandhi. Although Gandhi's concubines would retailiate stating, "Your *** is curry." Then the Dalia would get pummeled into oneness by a bunch of teenage Indian girls. Your winner Ghandi!!!!!!
Reply:DALAI LAMA AKA GOD
Who would win in a fair fight? The Dalai Lama or Ghandi?
well they would NEVER resolve to physical volence so...they would have to have a rap showdown,a dance contest, drag race ,or something?????
Reply:One hand slapping.
Reply:Dalai Lama! He weighs more and he's taller.
Reply:Dalai Lama, he is wiser and can distract Ghandi.
Wait, Ghandi is dead.!
Reply:Chuck Norris
Reply:Ther are or were both quite frail, I think it would be a boring fight
Reply:Neither. They would not get into it in the first place.
Reply:Since neither would fight because it is against their beliefs, the first on to drop dead loses. Ghandi is a hunger striking pro, so the Dalai Lama would lose.
Reply:They wouldn't fight.
Reply:Adi Da knows "The Dualing Crane Comes Down"
Reply:They would never fight. That's like asking Mother Teresa and the Virgin Mary to duke it out! Whoa, they're both dead!
We should put Tony Blair and wimpy GWB in the ring and make them duke it out. More like it .
Reply:The Dalia Lama would learn the futility of violence by striking repeatedly the Indian man of peace, Gandhi. Although Gandhi's concubines would retailiate stating, "Your *** is curry." Then the Dalia would get pummeled into oneness by a bunch of teenage Indian girls. Your winner Ghandi!!!!!!
Reply:DALAI LAMA AKA GOD
Do you think MMA fighters/ UFC destroy the beauty of martial arts?
It is good that people practice mixed martial arts wich is better than beeing limited by one type. But when you think of martial arts fighting, you think of 2 guys in their style uniform fighting swiftly, ( not exactly like the old movies but kinda like it) I mea arts like wing chun, karate, espacially kung fu etc. But then u watch an mma fight/ufc and you see 2 half naked guys just wearing shorts and pounding at each other like 2 beast in a bar fight. I repeat i am not hating, i am just saying that for mee seeing them makes me think as martial arts getting ugly, not appealing. It is good thing tho, just makes ma look ugly, like i dont even wanna watch it and learn it. and its not just the shorts, its also the ugly way they fight and the fact that they almost all look the same.
Do you think MMA fighters/ UFC destroy the beauty of martial arts?
I don't think that MMA fighters make MAs look bad at all. If anything, MMAs makes it look real and aplicable. It's beautiful in it's own right. And you're right, it doesn't look exactally like it does in movies, but that's what those are, movies. In movie the fights are coreographed like a musical coreographs a song and dance routine in the movie or on stage. The reason why in a MMA fight, the fighters are hald naked, is that it allows a more even playing field and less things for an opponent to grab on to. What do you think MA arts were originally? do you think the just got together to dance? I'm sure it would look just as pretty as a MMA fight with it's own respectable differences. It wouldn't be like your pretty movie dancing. That's why there are different schools that focus on different aspects of MAs. People have different tasts. you see to guys rolling around on the ground beating each other. I see a martial arsts trying to obtain a mount by bypassing his opponents guard and obtain a dominant possition. At the same time, trying not to allow the guy on the bottom sweep him and take his possition on top. You see a couple guys on the ground holding hands. I see a fighter trying for an armbar or a kumorah while the other is trying to counter and get a rear nake choke. You see to guys hgging on the fence. I see 2 martail artist in the clinch trying for a take down while giving knee and elbow strikes to eachother. Just like point fighting, just like in the movies, etc there is an art to fighting and it's just as beautiful as any other application of martail arts. Just like watching Chuck Liddell give a left to Rampages ribs while Rampage counters with a heavy right to Chuck's left jaw. I'm sorry it happend to Chuck, but to me....that was beautiful.
Reply:Not really.
I view MMA fighters and UFC as something entirely different and seperate from traditional martial arts.
Reply:I understand your point, but it is more realistic then point fighting.
Reply:To be quite honest - yes. When watching UFC and MMA fights, that's what they look like, fights. There is no "style" to speak of. I'd rather watch karate vs. tkd, or judo, or whatever, like UFC was in the beginning.
Reply:I do not think it destroys the beauty, I think it actually makes you appeciate different styles and beauty involved in other martial arts. I understand your point but I just feel like once you watch the UFC and then you watch someone doing karate you appreciate the beauty more because you can see how complex, wide ranging and diverse martial arts really are and what its all about. I think someone who truly cares about martial arts will look at both and see beauty in all aspects of ma. I love to watch MMA, I am a huge fan and watch as much as possible but I also get great pleasure out of watching traditional martial arts in practice as well, their is beauty in all aspects of the game.
Reply:Well my friend, you will get varied opinions about all this, but here is what it comes down to.
Aside from a few Martial Arts (mainly forms of Shaolin Kung Fu), Martial Arts weren't meant for beauty or their aesthetic value. They were meant for fighting.
Most of the outfits you associate Martial Arts with came as a tradition (the Gi, as originally based off the Kimono) or traditional dress at the time of the Art's foundation.
Many forms of Kung Fu were meant as a means towards spiritual enlightenment, focus, effeciency of motion and breath, and tuning your body for oneness. Even those were not meant to be beautiful, but were meant to draw in and center yourself while disciplining yourself mentally, spiritually, and physically.
While maintaining the tradition of these arts is something I think needs to occur. (Someone needs to maintain this culture, as it was wonderous and fascinating) I again feel the need to stress that Martial Arts were meant for fighting. Which in itself is not beautiful.
Sadly, when people think of Martial Arts fighting (especially outsiders) they think of the movies. Choreographed movements that are not only ineffecient but done so to look better. (Honestly, martial arts fight choreography is an artform in itself).
Martial Arts were based in violence, ugly, brutal violence. The ugly way you think of MMA fighters, is good in some ways. Because that is what fighting is, damn ugly.
Most athletes in some sense look the same, (i.e. in shape).
Fighting is ugly.
I think that is something you are seeing, Martial Arts aren't meant for aesthetics, it just so happens many of the traditional Martial Arts appear that way. The Katas and Forms and the like. (Keep in mind, Kata and Forms are not meant for fighting, they are meant to prepare and condition your body for those movements in a fight) So yes, kicking the air looks beautiful as someone does it with grace and balance. Kicking someone in the head usually isn't quite a pretty.
As I said, I don't think the culture of these traditional martial arts should be lost. (Much the same as there are still katas, and even JJ based Katas in Judo, that one learns at the highest levels). However effectiveness in combat requires ugly brutality, and blood, sweat, and tears. Martial Arts are meant to be combat effective, not aesthetic.
I think there are traditional schools that are in the strictest sense traditional (i.e. hard sparring, hard body conditioning, actually fighting).
Then there are traditional schools that embrace a different side of what they feel is traditional, and adhere to the more friendly aesthetically pleasing, kid friendly, money making way. And try to further sell the mysticism sometimes associated with martial arts.
The public perception, and even the perception of many Martial Artists who embraced this mentality of Asianophile mystic type of tradition is that Martial Arts are the key to unlocking some great inner energy and power. That it's point is in betterment of yourself and while they will claim that they are even more effective than professional fighter in terms of street combat, due to their spiritual oneness and discipline, they are in fact, incredibly ineffective due to absolutely no experience in adrenaline based situations or actual combat.
The old masters fought people constantly, including having to fight for their lives many times. That was their secret to effectiveness, their movements and training methods were tremendous helps (katas, forms, conditioning) but it was their constant experience in fighting that truly made them deadly and respected, and garnered them disciples.
True Martial Arts fighting (look at Wing Chun master Emin Bozetep taking on William Cheung. (videos of it all over youtube) two self proclaimed true Wing Chun masters. Watch what it actually looks like.
Look at the early UFC and what it actually looked like when Martial Arts masters took on each other. There have been plenty of no holds mixed martial arts (Open) tournaments going on way before then. Again it looked more like kickboxing and wrestling then what you think Martial Arts based fighting would look like.
Unfortunately the perception of Martial Arts fighting comes from Choreography, and old point fighting Karate tournaments. Actual fighting even between two Martial Arts masters looks much differently, (and more often like an untrained brawl).
I think there is something to be said about the beauty and aesthetic aspect to many traditional Martial Arts, and I am glad that some embrace that and keep that part of the culture alive. Some places are great and blending both, the traditional hard training, hard sparring, actual combat oriented, combined with forms, traditions, etc.
I think MMA is the closest embodiement to what Martial Arts actually used to be. (aside from uniform) Many Martial Arts were based on fighting with weapons, or in armor, etc. The shorts in MMA are just a means of advantage for the fighters against each other.
Older tournaments simply wore the garb of the day. Though some did indeed feature less uniforms than the others. (The Olympics in ancient time were done in the nude)
So in my opinion the beauty (aesthetic, ineffective) aspect of Martial Arts is not diminished as that caters to a different ideology, one of cultural preservation, whereas the UFC/MMA caters to unarmed combat effectiveness.
It is infact more complex and strategic than most single Martial Arts.
It all depends on your definition of Martial Arts and what they mean. To some it is the preservation of a culture, spiritual enlightenment, and adhering to certain principles of tradition. To others Martial Arts is about bettering yourself and your ability to fight, and through that you gain enlightenment of self, as well as discipline and confidence.
I think both sides have their pluses and minuses, and neither really diminish each other. But perhaps shows each side where they are lacking.
MMA/UFC types shows many other arts what they are lacking combat wise.
Traditional MA shows what the UFC/MMA types are lacking in Spiritually, Centered, and Calmness side.
Some people are lucky enough to have both.
*edit* Sorry I know I already wrote a book. Yupagee will probably get best answer for agreeing with you, but he is a traditionalist. Disregard below, as it is strictly for Yupagee's answer.
There is a hundred times more discipline and respect in the average MMA fighter than there is in 90 percent of traditional Martial Artists in America.
These guys wake up at the crack of dawn, and train until after dark. The eat a regimented diet, live a regimented lifestyle. And aside from a few pros, do it for very little money. They run, lift weights, work on technique, work on technique some more, work with a variety of disciplines and coaches. (Almost all of them are cross training with a boxing coach, a muay thai coach, a brazilian jujitsu coach, etc) They are cramming in two or three times the discipline, not to mention the respect they have for each other and coaches.
Can't tell you how many power hungry disrespectful 14 year old black belts I have seen in Traditional Arts. Or how many damn disrespectful punk kids I have seen in tournaments. For that matter, I have seen and see in great abundance here in Yahoo answers, 30 and 40 year old black belt traditional Martial Artists that are disrespectful to any other art than their own. Or any art that actually engages in combat.
Saying MMA lacks discipline or respect is ignorant of the fighters, the sport, and what it actually encompasses. You train one art, 3 days a week. They train 3 or 4 arts six or seven times a week. They bow to many Senseis, and treat each other with respect. Not to mention the average McDojo traditional teacher probably makes more than 80 percent of the MMA fighters. Aside from a few big names, most pull in maybe 20 grand from fighting,(10 grand for a UFC pro undercard fight, and get to do that maybe twice a year) and they have to beg for sponsorship.
One thing a MMA fighter does have in truckloads in discipline and respect. Something I see lacking in many traditional schools full of fat white "Masters" who insist on being called Sensei, Sempai, or Master even outside of the dojo. Who demand respect but do little to earn it.
I always respect your opinion Yupagee, but saying they lack discipline and respect is pretty damn ignorant.
Reply:Beauty, if you mean traditional bs that dosen't work. IF that is how you define beauty then yes.
MMA has show all the "traditional" martial artist how ineffective there styles are in real combat. That upsets most and they defend it by crying about how mma isn't a martial art or how it lacks spiritualness or what ever. In reality it has show you that tradition is weak and worthless in the streets, plain and simple.
Reply:I agree 110%. MMA lacks the discipline %26amp; respect of any true Martial Art.
Reply:No it just points out weaknesses of differnet martial arts.
java
Do you think MMA fighters/ UFC destroy the beauty of martial arts?
I don't think that MMA fighters make MAs look bad at all. If anything, MMAs makes it look real and aplicable. It's beautiful in it's own right. And you're right, it doesn't look exactally like it does in movies, but that's what those are, movies. In movie the fights are coreographed like a musical coreographs a song and dance routine in the movie or on stage. The reason why in a MMA fight, the fighters are hald naked, is that it allows a more even playing field and less things for an opponent to grab on to. What do you think MA arts were originally? do you think the just got together to dance? I'm sure it would look just as pretty as a MMA fight with it's own respectable differences. It wouldn't be like your pretty movie dancing. That's why there are different schools that focus on different aspects of MAs. People have different tasts. you see to guys rolling around on the ground beating each other. I see a martial arsts trying to obtain a mount by bypassing his opponents guard and obtain a dominant possition. At the same time, trying not to allow the guy on the bottom sweep him and take his possition on top. You see a couple guys on the ground holding hands. I see a fighter trying for an armbar or a kumorah while the other is trying to counter and get a rear nake choke. You see to guys hgging on the fence. I see 2 martail artist in the clinch trying for a take down while giving knee and elbow strikes to eachother. Just like point fighting, just like in the movies, etc there is an art to fighting and it's just as beautiful as any other application of martail arts. Just like watching Chuck Liddell give a left to Rampages ribs while Rampage counters with a heavy right to Chuck's left jaw. I'm sorry it happend to Chuck, but to me....that was beautiful.
Reply:Not really.
I view MMA fighters and UFC as something entirely different and seperate from traditional martial arts.
Reply:I understand your point, but it is more realistic then point fighting.
Reply:To be quite honest - yes. When watching UFC and MMA fights, that's what they look like, fights. There is no "style" to speak of. I'd rather watch karate vs. tkd, or judo, or whatever, like UFC was in the beginning.
Reply:I do not think it destroys the beauty, I think it actually makes you appeciate different styles and beauty involved in other martial arts. I understand your point but I just feel like once you watch the UFC and then you watch someone doing karate you appreciate the beauty more because you can see how complex, wide ranging and diverse martial arts really are and what its all about. I think someone who truly cares about martial arts will look at both and see beauty in all aspects of ma. I love to watch MMA, I am a huge fan and watch as much as possible but I also get great pleasure out of watching traditional martial arts in practice as well, their is beauty in all aspects of the game.
Reply:Well my friend, you will get varied opinions about all this, but here is what it comes down to.
Aside from a few Martial Arts (mainly forms of Shaolin Kung Fu), Martial Arts weren't meant for beauty or their aesthetic value. They were meant for fighting.
Most of the outfits you associate Martial Arts with came as a tradition (the Gi, as originally based off the Kimono) or traditional dress at the time of the Art's foundation.
Many forms of Kung Fu were meant as a means towards spiritual enlightenment, focus, effeciency of motion and breath, and tuning your body for oneness. Even those were not meant to be beautiful, but were meant to draw in and center yourself while disciplining yourself mentally, spiritually, and physically.
While maintaining the tradition of these arts is something I think needs to occur. (Someone needs to maintain this culture, as it was wonderous and fascinating) I again feel the need to stress that Martial Arts were meant for fighting. Which in itself is not beautiful.
Sadly, when people think of Martial Arts fighting (especially outsiders) they think of the movies. Choreographed movements that are not only ineffecient but done so to look better. (Honestly, martial arts fight choreography is an artform in itself).
Martial Arts were based in violence, ugly, brutal violence. The ugly way you think of MMA fighters, is good in some ways. Because that is what fighting is, damn ugly.
Most athletes in some sense look the same, (i.e. in shape).
Fighting is ugly.
I think that is something you are seeing, Martial Arts aren't meant for aesthetics, it just so happens many of the traditional Martial Arts appear that way. The Katas and Forms and the like. (Keep in mind, Kata and Forms are not meant for fighting, they are meant to prepare and condition your body for those movements in a fight) So yes, kicking the air looks beautiful as someone does it with grace and balance. Kicking someone in the head usually isn't quite a pretty.
As I said, I don't think the culture of these traditional martial arts should be lost. (Much the same as there are still katas, and even JJ based Katas in Judo, that one learns at the highest levels). However effectiveness in combat requires ugly brutality, and blood, sweat, and tears. Martial Arts are meant to be combat effective, not aesthetic.
I think there are traditional schools that are in the strictest sense traditional (i.e. hard sparring, hard body conditioning, actually fighting).
Then there are traditional schools that embrace a different side of what they feel is traditional, and adhere to the more friendly aesthetically pleasing, kid friendly, money making way. And try to further sell the mysticism sometimes associated with martial arts.
The public perception, and even the perception of many Martial Artists who embraced this mentality of Asianophile mystic type of tradition is that Martial Arts are the key to unlocking some great inner energy and power. That it's point is in betterment of yourself and while they will claim that they are even more effective than professional fighter in terms of street combat, due to their spiritual oneness and discipline, they are in fact, incredibly ineffective due to absolutely no experience in adrenaline based situations or actual combat.
The old masters fought people constantly, including having to fight for their lives many times. That was their secret to effectiveness, their movements and training methods were tremendous helps (katas, forms, conditioning) but it was their constant experience in fighting that truly made them deadly and respected, and garnered them disciples.
True Martial Arts fighting (look at Wing Chun master Emin Bozetep taking on William Cheung. (videos of it all over youtube) two self proclaimed true Wing Chun masters. Watch what it actually looks like.
Look at the early UFC and what it actually looked like when Martial Arts masters took on each other. There have been plenty of no holds mixed martial arts (Open) tournaments going on way before then. Again it looked more like kickboxing and wrestling then what you think Martial Arts based fighting would look like.
Unfortunately the perception of Martial Arts fighting comes from Choreography, and old point fighting Karate tournaments. Actual fighting even between two Martial Arts masters looks much differently, (and more often like an untrained brawl).
I think there is something to be said about the beauty and aesthetic aspect to many traditional Martial Arts, and I am glad that some embrace that and keep that part of the culture alive. Some places are great and blending both, the traditional hard training, hard sparring, actual combat oriented, combined with forms, traditions, etc.
I think MMA is the closest embodiement to what Martial Arts actually used to be. (aside from uniform) Many Martial Arts were based on fighting with weapons, or in armor, etc. The shorts in MMA are just a means of advantage for the fighters against each other.
Older tournaments simply wore the garb of the day. Though some did indeed feature less uniforms than the others. (The Olympics in ancient time were done in the nude)
So in my opinion the beauty (aesthetic, ineffective) aspect of Martial Arts is not diminished as that caters to a different ideology, one of cultural preservation, whereas the UFC/MMA caters to unarmed combat effectiveness.
It is infact more complex and strategic than most single Martial Arts.
It all depends on your definition of Martial Arts and what they mean. To some it is the preservation of a culture, spiritual enlightenment, and adhering to certain principles of tradition. To others Martial Arts is about bettering yourself and your ability to fight, and through that you gain enlightenment of self, as well as discipline and confidence.
I think both sides have their pluses and minuses, and neither really diminish each other. But perhaps shows each side where they are lacking.
MMA/UFC types shows many other arts what they are lacking combat wise.
Traditional MA shows what the UFC/MMA types are lacking in Spiritually, Centered, and Calmness side.
Some people are lucky enough to have both.
*edit* Sorry I know I already wrote a book. Yupagee will probably get best answer for agreeing with you, but he is a traditionalist. Disregard below, as it is strictly for Yupagee's answer.
There is a hundred times more discipline and respect in the average MMA fighter than there is in 90 percent of traditional Martial Artists in America.
These guys wake up at the crack of dawn, and train until after dark. The eat a regimented diet, live a regimented lifestyle. And aside from a few pros, do it for very little money. They run, lift weights, work on technique, work on technique some more, work with a variety of disciplines and coaches. (Almost all of them are cross training with a boxing coach, a muay thai coach, a brazilian jujitsu coach, etc) They are cramming in two or three times the discipline, not to mention the respect they have for each other and coaches.
Can't tell you how many power hungry disrespectful 14 year old black belts I have seen in Traditional Arts. Or how many damn disrespectful punk kids I have seen in tournaments. For that matter, I have seen and see in great abundance here in Yahoo answers, 30 and 40 year old black belt traditional Martial Artists that are disrespectful to any other art than their own. Or any art that actually engages in combat.
Saying MMA lacks discipline or respect is ignorant of the fighters, the sport, and what it actually encompasses. You train one art, 3 days a week. They train 3 or 4 arts six or seven times a week. They bow to many Senseis, and treat each other with respect. Not to mention the average McDojo traditional teacher probably makes more than 80 percent of the MMA fighters. Aside from a few big names, most pull in maybe 20 grand from fighting,(10 grand for a UFC pro undercard fight, and get to do that maybe twice a year) and they have to beg for sponsorship.
One thing a MMA fighter does have in truckloads in discipline and respect. Something I see lacking in many traditional schools full of fat white "Masters" who insist on being called Sensei, Sempai, or Master even outside of the dojo. Who demand respect but do little to earn it.
I always respect your opinion Yupagee, but saying they lack discipline and respect is pretty damn ignorant.
Reply:Beauty, if you mean traditional bs that dosen't work. IF that is how you define beauty then yes.
MMA has show all the "traditional" martial artist how ineffective there styles are in real combat. That upsets most and they defend it by crying about how mma isn't a martial art or how it lacks spiritualness or what ever. In reality it has show you that tradition is weak and worthless in the streets, plain and simple.
Reply:I agree 110%. MMA lacks the discipline %26amp; respect of any true Martial Art.
Reply:No it just points out weaknesses of differnet martial arts.
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